Super Star Destroyer Vs Enterprise

Super Star Destroyer (Star Wars) Vs Enterprise (Star Trek)

Fun match in theory, but I am not sure the super star destroyer would do very well against the Enterprise. I think the Enterprise would zip in and out of warp speed to essentially attack at will.

Enterprise with the easy victory. What say you?

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685 Comments on "Super Star Destroyer Vs Enterprise"

  1. EMOboy July 18, 2011 at 9:19 am -      #601

    “The weapons seen hitting the inside of the gun rooms were not turbo-lasers, but instead a more primitive lesser weapon”

    Absurdity as it would mean they put weapons on the ship for heavy cruiser vs heavy cruiser action that were 0.000000000000000001% or less of what they had available.

    “a majority of they yield may have been used up in melting/vaporizing Armour…”

    If that was so then the area would have been filled with expanding superheated gas made from the Armour.

    “my calcs were not based of eyeballing explosions but instead energy requirements to vaporize various quantities of armor”

    Got any before vaporisation and after vaporisation images or links to them so we can see how much was missing after vaporisation, also links to images of the expanding gases from said vaporisation would be nice.

  2. Sauroposeidon July 18, 2011 at 9:46 am -      #602

    I always find it interesting how the vast majority of the time Cap Ships lumber about with all the grace and speed of a beached whale when they fight, and when they do it, they do it up close, or at least close enough to see each other QUITE clearly.. and tend to miss at times as well.

    Then the fans come along and all of a sudden ships are fighting at extreme speeds with city destroying attacks that never miss from distances at very extreme distances where the two should not even be able to make out each other, fighting with sensors alone as they blaze away at what is but yet another twinkle amongst the sea of stars… but they still hold the other side to being the antiquated beast that moves at the speed of smell and strikes with all the force that one would expect to be seen with safe pyrotechnics around actors from with in only a few dozen city widths at best for maximum attack range.

  3. farfromit July 18, 2011 at 3:34 pm -      #603

    Clone trooper armour is designed to withstand and/or reduce multimegajoule range thermal attacks, the armour would take many maybe tens of gigajoules or more to completely vaporize.
    The weapons penetrating the gun rooms were point defence, hence kiloton range and at best megaton range, shields could have reduced thier energy further.
    starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Flak_gun
    The purpose of these weapons when fired ship to ship, may not be to do massive hukll damage, but rather as a more of a grape shot, firing through gaps or weakspots in the hull, to kill crew. This is the role seen in the film, and would make sense as they are commonly used by pirates.

    For instances of lasers hitting armour, look to the battle over coruscant, and there is a sceme where a heavy turbolaser bolt impacts on an ISD hull, vaporizing its way down to the reactor resulting in the total evaportation of the entire ship.

  4. BC July 18, 2011 at 9:02 pm -      #604

    ” Clone trooper armour is designed to withstand and/or reduce multimegajoule range thermal attacks, the armour would take many maybe tens of gigajoules or more to completely vaporize. ”

    Are you seriously trying to say that it would take two and a half tons of tnt kill an armored
    clone trooper? Even if that were the case the level of energy of the bolt that came
    through the firing port would have still been more than enough if they are so incredibly
    powerful as the claims state they are.

    ” The weapons penetrating the gun rooms were point defence, hence kiloton range and at best megaton range, shields could have reduced thier energy further. ”

    Sure, sure, the old doge of if the visuals do not support the inflated power claims then
    the bolt must have come from point defense. And this is always without any proof of where the bolt
    came from was actually a point defense weapon. That old trick would be like when trek ship
    weapon performance is disappointing and the ships guns are not explicitly shown firing (that is a rarity, paramount loves their firing stock footage) claiming it was actually someone standing on the hull with a phaser rifle. Silly? certainly, and it gets old fast.

    ” For instances of lasers hitting armour, look to the battle over coruscant, and there is a sceme where a heavy turbolaser bolt impacts on an ISD hull, vaporizing its way down to the reactor resulting in the total evaportation of the entire ship. ”

    Ships explode like that in both universes from beam weapon hits, however it does not produce calculable results because the materials used are not completely known, nor is the condition of the ship before the hit usually known. Also an unknown explosive force from a reactor whose properties are unknown destroying a ship of unknown materials does not give any more information than a beam of unknown energy level hitting and defeating armor for which the characteristics numbers are unknown.

    ” I always find it interesting how the vast majority of the time Cap Ships lumber about with all the grace and speed of a beached whale when they fight, and when they do it, they do it up close, or at least close enough to see each other QUITE clearly.. and tend to miss at times as well. ”

    Paramount only shows outside views of the close and slow battles, for the others you have to listen to the bridge dialog during a non visual combat scene. It does not help either that they try to emulate star wars style point blank combat “to increase tension and excitement” (which can be interpreted as the usual hollywood lemming effect where everyone trys to cash in on the most popular thing at the moment which in the case of early TNG was star wars) in some places and use traditional trek style combat by dialog and bridge scenes which makes for a lot of inconsistencies.
    So in one battle with one set of director, sfx crew, and writer you get slow lumbering capital ships slowly hammering at each other in knife fight range and in others with a different combination you get long range sword dancing, and yet others an uneasy mix of the two.

    An often cited case when enterprise-d is in orbit and encounters an enemy ship (or at least the mental illusion of one) with Wesley at the helm the enterprise slowly wallows around and crawls away from the ship while in other scenes (like the ds9 combat scenes for instance) they turn and move like reasonably agile aircraft (though still in a kind of slow motion). In orbit it possible they do not have the impulse engines engaged and are moving on thrusters though the dialog does not make it clear what exactly they are using, yet anti-trek types keep insisting that it is the standard for trek maneuver, all the while ignoring the star wars equivalent of the low end effect like when the isds sideswipe each other apparently unable to avoid each other despite being in sight range long enough for Han and Leia to argue about the situation and then Han to maneuver out from between the two.

  5. farfromit July 18, 2011 at 9:33 pm -      #605

    “Are you seriously trying to say that it would take two and a half tons of tnt kill an armored
    clone trooper?”
    NO. I am most certainly not, i am saying it takes double digit megajoule thermal attacks to kill the, and that it would take extreme energy to tottally vaporize the armour. Hence close proximity kiloton blasts may not result in turning the near by clones to ash as would be expected.

    “Sure, sure, the old doge of if the visuals do not support the inflated power claims then
    the bolt must have come from point defense. And this is always without any proof of where the bolt
    came from was actually a point defense weapon.”
    starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Flak_gun

    “hitting and defeating armor for which the characteristics numbers are unknown”
    As i said estimated strength based of effects from known weapons.

  6. BC July 19, 2011 at 1:23 am -      #606

    ” “Are you seriously trying to say that it would take two and a half tons of tnt kill an armored
    clone trooper?”
    NO. I am most certainly not, i am saying it takes double digit megajoule thermal attacks to kill the, and that it would take extreme energy to tottally vaporize the armour. Hence close proximity kiloton blasts may not result in turning the near by clones to ash as would be expected. ”

    The troopers would not have to worry about their armor getting vaporized in any case, the overpressure of that much energy acting on the air in the room would smash them to jelly making the heat effect on their armor moot.

    ” “Sure, sure, the old doge of if the visuals do not support the inflated power claims then
    the bolt must have come from point defense. And this is always without any proof of where the bolt
    came from was actually a point defense weapon.”
    starwars.wikia.com/wiki/Flak_gun ”

    If the gun pictured is indeed a flak gun, an idea apparently stolen from battlestar galactica from what i have been able to find out that seems to be catching on in the fannon circles at least, that still does not identify what it was hit by which is the important part.

    While it is a bit of a digression talking about the gun that was hit instead of the bolt
    that hit it i do have to say that if that bay was just flak guns that any respect for ship design in star wars has gone down considerably in my view. Looking closely at the Hand reveals that there are only one row of those guns on one side of the ship and no other guns are visible which makes a capital armed only with anti-fighter popguns, and not even very many of them. And to top it off such an ill equipped ship is used to go toe to toe with other capital ships that are
    presumably properly armed with anti-ship weapons as well as anti-fighter. Then of all of the ships of his fleet the general decides to hold the mcguffin for the whole battle on a defensive-only armed ship with those defenses on ONLY ONE SIDE of the ship. No wonder Grevious lost that battle

    ” “hitting and defeating armor for which the characteristics numbers are unknown”
    As i said estimated strength based of effects from known weapons. ”

    Known from what? The numbers in the ICS book? It still makes no sense if that is the case, it would be trying to corroborate questionable numbers by using them calibrate the test which is in turn run and the numbers of course come back out ‘confirmed’ since they are the numbers the ‘test’ is based on.

  7. farfromit July 19, 2011 at 9:22 am -      #607

    “identify what it was hit by which is the important part.”
    I belive the flak gun was hit by a flak shell gro another flak gun.

    “defensive-only armed ship”
    Well, it has been the case in some novels that shps simply blow the anti capital ship weapons of when shields have been lowered,leaving them to slugit out. Also th Venator does not to shoot for kill, so they may have purpoesly dispatched te heavier weapons on Greviouses ship.

    “Known from what? The numbers in the ICS book?”
    Thre is a qoute/image in ICS that could suggest megatons per cubic meter of hea energy to vaporize. Myestimates were based of resistance to fighter weapons.

  8. BC July 19, 2011 at 9:59 pm -      #608

    ” “identify what it was hit by which is the important part.”
    I belive the flak gun was hit by a flak shell gro another flak gun. ”

    That is possible, though it would make it even worse for the troopers inside since it would would mean that the majority of the energy did not go into the hit gun, but rather that an omni-directional weapon detonated against it which means the compartment and all those in direct line of sight would have taken the primary effect which would have to substantial to damage fighters with the inflated defensive numbers, unless of course the actual defensive numbers are actually supposed to be much less than the inflated ICS type figures.

    ” “defensive-only armed ship”
    Well, it has been the case in some novels that shps simply blow the anti capital ship weapons of when shields have been lowered,leaving them to slugit out. Also th Venator does not to shoot for kill, so they may have purpoesly dispatched te heavier weapons on Greviouses ship. ”

    That is possible too, though the lack of visible wreaked heavy turrets suggests otherwise.

    ““Known from what? The numbers in the ICS book?”
    Thre is a qoute/image in ICS that could suggest megatons per cubic meter of hea energy to vaporize. Myestimates were based of resistance to fighter weapons. ”

    Unfortunately the only time fighter weapons are shown hitting a quantifiable target (an asteroid in TESB) they had no visible effect which means there is no way to quantify the power of them so the effects they have on armor of unknown characteristics would likewise be unquantifiable except in a relative sense that would not be useful in comparing it to anything outside the film.

  9. farfromit July 21, 2011 at 2:12 pm -      #609

    Yes, to be fair, what ever hit the flak cannon does appear to be megajoule or gigajoule range, as appoosed to terajoule or petajoule. It may be the case that these weapons are of this magnitude, or it may be the case that it is higher but the yield was weakened from energy shields. However these weapons appeared to cuase little damage within the gun room, so either they are extremely ineffective at destroying ships them selves and must be fired to weaker or unarmoured areas of the ship, or a majority of the yield is used else where.

    “armor of unknown characteristics would likewise be unquantifiable”

    The armour is ‘blaster proof’ which are double digit megajoule weapons, these weapons leave only small pock marks on light imperial walker armour, suggesting it takes mutiple megajoules per cubic center meters to vaporize, the starfighters have armour which is just as good if not better.

    I suspect imperial vehical/fighter would require multiple terajoules to vaporize per cubic meter.

  10. notafanboy December 25, 2011 at 2:06 am -      #610

    Star Wars has only seemed moderately science fiction to me. It’s more like Dungeons & Dragons with technology filling in for the magic since the technology is never given scientific explanation. The heroes of Star Wars are all archetypal fantasy characters: knights, princesses, rogues, mercenaries, and the obligatory “chosen one.” The whole thing romanticizes the Royalty America and France had revolutions to overcome [ideonexus.com], with its cynical portrayal of the Republic and idealization of the princess. Star Wars’ overall take on humanity is cynical, where, despite living in galaxy filled with technology resembling magic, people are just as unenlightened and motivated by baser desires as they are today.

    Good science fiction asks questions that pertain to the human condition and every single episode of Star Trek sets out to tackle the hard philosophical questions. Star Trek takes a positive perspective of humanity’s future, with upstanding characters who seek intelligent solutions to social and technological dilemmas presented to them. The humans in Star Trek are the role-models for other species. Earth is the center of the Federation of Planets, the center of a working democratic United Nations on a galactic scale, complete with a Prime Directive to prevent a repeat of Earth’s colonialist mistakes. Star Trek gets accused of being “Philosopher Kings in Space” or of presenting an idealistic vision of Communism, but these can also be seen as criticisms of the character’s intellectualism and their personal virtue of serving the greater good, as academia is called elitist and humanism accused of socialism in today’s society. The fact that we can even have such a debate about the sociopolitical dimensions of Star Trek make it a million-bazillion-times more nerdy than Star Wars’ blaster and saber show.

    Star Wars is fantasy, Star Trek is SF, and I can rant on and on and on [ideonexus.com] about the differences between the two and why SF is vastly superior in every dimension, with the exception of fantasy making better escapist fare for when you want to turn off your brain for a few hours.

  11. BC January 6, 2012 at 11:42 pm -      #611

    True, Star Trek has always been (or at least until the Abrams-verse Star Trek anyway) mainline science fiction, and Star Wars was always meant to be Buck Rogers/Flash Gordon style space opera, though there are exceptions on each side.
    -

    Both are good in their genres and I do not understand why some people seem to think that liking one of them automatically means hating the other.

  12. StealthRanger January 6, 2012 at 11:43 pm -      #612

    “Both are good in their genres and I do not understand why some people seem to think that liking one of them automatically means hating the other.”
    -
    This x1000
    -
    Star Dreadnought for the FP Award

  13. Richard Rider February 2, 2013 at 1:31 pm -      #613

    Star Wars Vs Star Trek: Could The Empire Kick The Federation’s Ass Page132.
    “Dear God,” Captain Picard says as the Executor, which has just popped out of hyperspace over Earth, appears on the Enterprise’s viewscreen. “What is it?”
    “It is the largest ship ever recorded, sir,” says Data. “Although not as thick, it is more than six times as long as a Borg Cube and at least as well armed.”
    “Hailing frequencies.”
    Darth Vader appears on the viewscreen.
    “I am Captain Jean-Luc Picard of the United Federation of Planets. What is the nature of your visit?”
    “I am here to welcome you Captain.”
    Picard allows himself an uncertain smile. “Should we not be welcoming you? You are on the doorstep of our home planet.”
    “Yes. That is why we are here; to welcome your Federation to the Empire!”
    “They are arming weapons, sir.”
    “Shields up! Mr. Data, get us out of here!”
    “I’m trying sir, but they seem to have caught us in some sort of tractor beam.”
    “Full reverse!”
    “It’s no good,” says Commander Riker. “We’re not gaining an inch.”
    “Fine,” says Picard as a swarm of TIE Fighters pours out of the great dreadnought. “If they want the Enterprise so much, let’s give it to them. Full impulse ahead, Mr Data. Aim for their bridge.”
    RESULT: The Executor earns its name today.
    Executor for the FP Award!

  14. Sauroposeidon February 2, 2013 at 1:54 pm -      #614

    ….I’m 100% certain that if a 600 meter ship crashed in to its bridge it would go down as well. Although tractor beams appear to have a negative effect on Trek shields, rapidly draining them for reasons that I’m pretty sure are never explained. It’s how the Borg fuck up Feddie vessels on a regular basis, usually. Mmm.. Borg.. I’ma go watch stuff with robots now..

  15. BC February 2, 2013 at 3:51 pm -      #615

    Why even bother ramming in a situation like that when at that ridiculously close range they could easily put a stream of photon or quantum torpedoes right into the bridge windows (though it might still result in a mutual kill from the back blast of torpedoes used at too close of a range with their safeties switched off like that). Even if the shields held for several hits they would not last long with the torpedoes hitting the exact same spot over and over.
    -
    For that matter they would be able to target the phasers directly on Vaders helmet and call which eyeball they wanted to hit.

  16. Sauroposeidon February 2, 2013 at 4:29 pm -      #616

    “Why even bother ramming in a situation like that when at that ridiculously close range they could easily put a stream of photon or quantum torpedoes right into the bridge windows (though it might still result in a mutual kill from the back blast of torpedoes used at too close of a range with their safeties switched off like that). Even if the shields held for several hits they would not last long with the torpedoes hitting the exact same spot over and over.”
    -
    Hey don’t ask me, I didn’t write the book.

  17. rebel hunter 264 February 10, 2013 at 1:51 am -      #617

    doommunchkin March 14, 2009 at 11:34 pm – #24
    I love this site. It’s one of the only places on the internet where the facts matter more than what is shown on t.v., books or any other commercial outlet. I remember reading the rouge squadron books back in the day and I remember them taking out (victory class I think) star destroyers. If you look at the facts about all the ships involved in that fight you come to understand there is no way to do what they did. O.K. sure, rouge squadron is badass, but come on, people read that and think “oh, so taking out a SD is just that easy huh”. please. You dont name something that awesome a STAR DESTROYER for no reason. Real life doesnt have conveniently located exhaust ports. That crap only works in the movies and only then to make up for the nonexistent imaginations of the monkeys in hollywood. Honestly, I cant name one game, book, movie, t.v. show that has solid continuity and I atribute that to the need to make money over the need to make a good story. Basically, if you put to many hands in the cookie pot all you get is crumbs.

    For the record to the person made this statement the reason behind rebel torpedoes ruining SD’s is cos they use high yield shield breach torpedoes these types of explosives are only used by the empire and some extremely powerful crimelords designed to cripple or destroy capital ships now how the rebellion has these is through supporters in the empire they have limited amounts of these though. For ur statement of why the death star has exhaust ports is because 1 hypermatter reactors generate so much unusable waste heat it has to be vented & 2 which is probably less since death star 2 was created is hypermatter reactors were still in baby steps when death star 1 was built as to why stormtroopers cant aim is because when the movies were made clones were being phased out of use from civilians who cant aim for crap and for your statement of them using lasers they use plasma and the statement of the ties they were meant to be mass produced to horde though some officers requested the v wings return ties work well u can make 22 billion of them in a week for half the price of a shielded fuel dependant heavily armed single vessel when you can have 3 separate types for all vessels for a better price leaving money in the kitty for SSD’s besides they had vaders tiex2 and the tie defender for x wings. Also for those who were saying the enterprise could do anything well on the trek wiki it states that phasers have no effect on neutronium which ill give you 3 guesses to wat makes up durasteel the main starship hull material.

  18. rebel hunter 264 February 10, 2013 at 2:13 am -      #618

    Sauroposeidon February 2, 2013 at 4:29 pm – #616
    “Why even bother ramming in a situation like that when at that ridiculously close range they could easily put a stream of photon or quantum torpedoes right into the bridge windows (though it might still result in a mutual kill from the back blast of torpedoes used at too close of a range with their safeties switched off like that). Even if the shields held for several hits they would not last long with the torpedoes hitting the exact same spot over and over.”
    -
    Hey don’t ask me, I didn’t write the book

    to you sorry cant remember your username theres one issue with your idea it took over 10 armed to the teeth mon calamari cruisers with ion cannons ( which for your knowledge disables technology) to do any damage to executor at point blank range no less to drop shields now photon now star destroyer.com states photon torpedoes have a maximum theoretical yield of 64 now ( just to notify you the only reason a lone a wing destroyed executors bridge was because of a 2 hour firefight that was begining to wain to the empire until executors shields failed because of the point blank emp field from 10 fully armed battlecruisers for 1 lucky crash from an A-wing) that would do nothing if executor had full shields and the enterprise wouldn’t last 60 seconds thanks to the over laping fire from executor so example “commander weapons fire in comming” “evasive manuvers”.”aye sir” now possibility 1 they bank left they hit the left battery fire covering the side exit possibility 2 they bank right they hit the right side battery fire covering the right side exit possibility 3 they duck down they hit the lower battery fire that is around the primary hangar bay and possibility 4 they bank up and they hit the top deck batteries left after right and left are covering the sides vaders not an idiot you know. I’m done

  19. rebel hunter 264 February 10, 2013 at 2:53 am -      #619

    BC February 2, 2013 at 3:51 pm – #615
    Why even bother ramming in a situation like that when at that ridiculously close range they could easily put a stream of photon or quantum torpedoes right into the bridge windows (though it might still result in a mutual kill from the back blast of torpedoes used at too close of a range with their safeties switched off like that). Even if the shields held for several hits they would not last long with the torpedoes hitting the exact same spot over and over.
    -
    For that matter they would be able to target the phasers directly on Vaders helmet and call which eyeball they wanted to hit.

    theres an issue with that statement executor would have fired all lower deck weapons on the enterprise and if tractor beam disable shields the the vessel would be in so many pieces its warp cores wouldn’t have had time to overload and explode as they always do in star trek and even with shields the turbolasers would have vaporised the enterprise just as quickly (and to thoughs who know noting turbolasers don’t use lasers they use plasma) really and if 19000 meters of indestructable durasteel when up against phasers which is impossible then the empire sends in the eclipse 2 which has a dumbed down death star laser! which has targeting capacity to target ants in the ground thats planetside also quantum torpedoes really all they are are plasma torpedoes which struggles with solid neutronium and they empire never takes less than the best quality materials to be used in durasteel ( dont beleive me about durasteel check wookipedia and all references attached) also photon torpedoes really antimatter now if quantum torpedoes (which are according to the fans who do the star trek wiki’s are plasma torpedoes) are the better than antimatter starfleet sucks proton torpedoes are plasma torpedoes that also apart form bypassing shields thanks to plasma releases protons at subatomic speeds to damage the object at the atomic level also if to destroy a hollow asteroid it took a whole photon torpedo payload (from the series not made up by me form the episode ‘pegasus’) it wouldn’t be able to scratch the shields of executor even without shields executors size and material build would leave it impossible to destroy by one enterprise d class.

  20. Murder March 6, 2013 at 4:30 pm -      #620

    Enterprise beams a photon onto the bridge of the pizza slice and ship goes boom. SW has no teleporters and never has. It does not have the frequency modulation to block subatomic matter streaming. Pew-Pew!

  21. rebel hunter 264 March 9, 2013 at 4:06 am -      #621

    Murder March 6, 2013 at 4:30 pm – #620
    Enterprise beams a photon onto the bridge of the pizza slice and ship goes boom. SW has no teleporters and never has. It does not have the frequency modulation to block subatomic matter streaming. Pew-Pew!

    but last time I checked in star trek you can’t beam matter through shields according to star trek fans I’ve met and the star trek wiki also your making the assumption that the enterprise has the weapons capability to crack imperial shielding even though it’s clearly stated on star destroyer.net for example the acclamator class weapon systems to enterprise D 300 million gigawatts and 2.4 million megatons of energy per shot for the acclamator then 3.6 gigawatts and 64 megatons now first of all that fire power was for 36 guns now executor has 10,000 guns so in a one on one enterprise is toast even in a fleet to executor executor would win because of the weapons coverage and shield dissipation for an acclamators shields which you always double for executor is 70 trillion gigawatts then theres enterprises 3311 gigawatts so you do the math enterprise wouldn’t last long enough to drop executors shields to even consider beaming photon torpedoes into executors bridge and also considering it took a fleet of heavy cruisers at point blank range to knock out executors shields shown in the history of executor on Wookiepeida battle of endor.

  22. Halo nrd FTW March 9, 2013 at 7:36 am -      #622

    star destroyer roflstomps enterprise

  23. rebel hunter 264 August 4, 2013 at 4:10 am -      #623

    frequency modulation to block subatomic matter streaming. Pew-Pew!
    also doesn’t have frequency modulation thats what ray and particle shielding is for read the lore

  24. Dassadec August 4, 2013 at 4:32 am -      #624

    Enterprise can pick targets at superior range all day, and Federation firepower has lifewiping capability. Hell Aelfinn calced out a 200 year old pre federation weapon out to low teratons, For Phaser fire…. they can drill to a planets, core and carve canals across continents to avert natural disasters and shit..
    and from Memory Alpha….
    “Starfleet began developing two types of photon torpedoes starting in 2215, with the primary difficulty being the design of the warhead. The first type had the deuterium and antideuterium reactants driven together like in an implosion design nuclear weapon. This torpedo had a maximum range of 750,000 kilometers, as this was the stability limit of the containment field design. It had a low rate of annihilation, and was adequate as a defensive weapon only. The second type, which became operational in 2271 had the reactants mixed together in thousands of small magnetic packets. This increased the rate of annihilation. This type had an effective tactical range from fifteen kilometers to 3.5 million kilometers. (pg. 128, 130) These range figures are however inconsistent with the range of below 300,000 kilometers established in “The Wounded” for a torpedo type used in 2367.”
    -
    By all means show me that the SSD can engage at that kind of range, Let alone hit a Ship travelling at warp when they have enough trouble hitting sublight Millenium falcon and fighters

  25. Kara Zor-El August 4, 2013 at 4:35 am -      #625

    Hoooh boy, this one’s going to sting xD
    _
    Are you using Aelfinn’s The Die is Cast calcs? xD

  26. Dassadec August 4, 2013 at 4:40 am -      #626

    Are you using Aelfinn’s The Die is Cast calcs
    -
    No, The attack of xindi Probe calc from ST:Enterprise when it carved a swath through florida down to past jamaica in 10 seconds or so, much more reliable IMO since noone can bitch”we don’t know what the planet’s made of”, I posted the scene he calced it, Noone came to refute/recalc it in the last part of ST vs SW we invited ZomB cordially and he promised he would :(

  27. Kara Zor-El August 4, 2013 at 4:43 am -      #627

    Ah okay. Though if the Enterprise can beat a SSD maybe the fight against the Pillar of Autumn should be revisited, no idea how the Pillar won mind you considering Trek’s sub light speeds. But I wasn’t really there for that fight.

  28. Dassadec August 4, 2013 at 4:48 am -      #628

    Yeah I was disgusted when I saw PoA beat The
    Enterprise-D, That must have been when Halo wank was accepted at face value, I see no way in hell the vaunted MAC could hit a federation vessel. lol. We should Sugest a rematch Is it past the five year rule?

  29. Namer August 4, 2013 at 8:08 am -      #629

    Wasn’t that match back in the days of the 1.17 teraton MACs? Yeah, Halowank and it needs a rematch.
    .
    Or maybe not. The Infinity would be a better candidate.

  30. StealthRanger August 4, 2013 at 8:09 am -      #630

    “Wasn’t that match back in the days of the 1.17 teraton MACs? Yeah, Halowank and it needs a rematch.”
    -
    Planet+ busting MACs actually

  31. Sauroposeidon August 4, 2013 at 8:34 am -      #631

    If this were the A I’d go with it.. but the D’s feats are no where near what the original series used to like to do.
    -
    I love the D.. but she sort of just wallows around in most of her battles. Picard plays her like a battle ship, while Kirk played his like a submarine. The best trick she has in her arsenal is the warp strafe, which works..once, and ONLY once.
    -
    Regardless of whatever numbers are thrown out, most battles take place in both sci-fi’s are extremely close range. Although SW ships in general seem to engage at longer ranges in Return of the Jedi, it was still made very clear that the imperial ships are better at close range and become a serious threat. Both sci-fi’s favor knife fighting during the time of the D and the SSD. You can cite whatever numbers you want, I’ll just go post a music video of the constant close in combat they like to do and the visuals don’t lie. I’m in favor of the SSD over the D. If this were just an ISD, relying on ion cannons, I think the D would take this, but the SSD’s play a lot more on their turbo lasers, missiles, and fighters.
    -
    I am primarily here for this, though. I don’t remember if I commented on this particular quote before, but I feel I must. It is my biggest gripe with Trek.
    -
    “I believe that it was stated in a Enterprise episode that this did not happen. The person transported was the same person and not a copy.”
    -
    NO! YOU DIE!
    -
    I would never, ever, EVER allow myself to be transported in this measure. No, the person who arrives is not a copy, this is true..but they are not you either. The original is completely destroyed. The new one is simply arranged using your particles. I can not support their method of transportation.

  32. Aelfinn August 4, 2013 at 10:52 am -      #632

    For what it’s worth, the Enterprise D did use its phaser to drill to a planet’s core. I could take a crack at that calc, but uuunnnnghggghghgh…

  33. Glutinous-Bicarbonate August 4, 2013 at 11:41 am -      #633

    I’m leery of teleportation in general. Too many things that can happen outside the normal danger of space travel.
    -
    I mean just looka this scene, and tell me you haven’t worried about the exact same thing.
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=nW-NiGp1gys
    -
    Noooo thank you! I’ll take a shuttle if its all the same to you.

  34. Sauroposeidon August 4, 2013 at 11:42 am -      #634

    Yeah, the dangers of it are pretty bad.. although I always wondered why they couldn’t just re-arrange your particles.. couldnt the computer save your data so as to rearrange you to be younger too? All sorts of shit that tech could do.. all of it unethical. Needs to be destroyed, the teleporter does. Shuttles and wormholes are far superior.

  35. Sauroposeidon August 4, 2013 at 11:45 am -      #635

    “For what it’s worth, the Enterprise D did use its phaser to drill to a planet’s core. I could take a crack at that calc, but uuunnnnghggghghgh…”
    -
    The Decepticon Devastator did this once with its fists.. I just pretend it never happened. It made life easier. Might I suggest doing the same?

  36. Aelfinn August 4, 2013 at 12:48 pm -      #636

    “I just pretend it never happened. It made life easier. Might I suggest doing the same?”
    -
    It could be a very important calc. It’s just that I would need to figure out the radius of the phaser, the temperature of the crust, mantle, and outer core, the depth of each one, the specific heat of stone while solid and while liquid, the melting point of stone, the boiling point of stone, and then convert the Joules to Tons of TnT

  37. Sauroposeidon August 4, 2013 at 1:11 pm -      #637

    I say that because it has further implications. If a phaser can easily slice a planet in half, that suddenly speaks an awful lot about the ships it’s shooting at.. and yet does not groove with things like the Doomsday Weapon, which does something similar but is considered a near undefeatable threat.
    -
    Similarly for Devastator, who fights by punching and bashing.. to be able to punch his way from through to the center of the planet in seconds… it’s a bit much.
    -
    There are points where I go “Nope. You’ve stopped trying to make sense. Try again tomorrow.” and carving one’s way through a god damn planet when nothing else previously was capable of such with any where near similar levels of ease.. that’s one of those points.

  38. VunderGuy August 4, 2013 at 1:12 pm -      #638

    Alright, so, HOW powerful in terms of TNT equivalent is the Enterprise?

  39. Aelfinn August 4, 2013 at 2:16 pm -      #639

    “and yet does not groove with things like the Doomsday Weapon, which does something similar but is considered a near undefeatable threat.”
    -
    Well, I’d have to disagree with you on that one. Drilling to the core is a lot different than blowing up an entire planet, and the Doomsday Weapon was defeated by running a spaceship into its mouth. These are the same spaceships where a single gram of antimatter from the core caused something like a 20-petaton explosion (the science is wrong, but you get the idea).

  40. Glutinous-Bicarbonate August 4, 2013 at 2:23 pm -      #640

    “A Gram of antimatter=20 petaton detonation”
    -
    Oh dear lord, Trek Writers.
    -
    E=MC’^2 motherfuckers, do you speak it!

  41. VunderGuy August 4, 2013 at 2:49 pm -      #641

    Isn’t a gram of antimater like a 30 to 57 megaton explosion?

  42. Glutinous-Bicarbonate August 4, 2013 at 2:53 pm -      #642

    More like roughly twenty kilotons, assuming “perfect” annihilation.
    -
    Unless I’m figuring the whole conversion wrong.

  43. VunderGuy August 4, 2013 at 3:05 pm -      #643

    Sorry. Was thinking kilograms.

    en.wikipedia.org/wiki/TNT_equivalent

  44. VunderGuy August 4, 2013 at 3:05 pm -      #644

    And even then, it’s only 21.5 megatons.

  45. Aelfinn August 4, 2013 at 3:12 pm -      #645

    “More like roughly twenty kilotons, assuming “perfect” annihilation.”
    -
    Well, it’s about 20 kilotons for a gram, so in a matter-antimatter reaction it would be about 40. Still insanely off of the demonstrated yield, though.
    -
    However, at least they got the idea that antimatter = big explosion right in the original series. In Voyager, there was an episode so bad they may have made it non-canon. In it, going to Warp 10 turned you into a lizard. Sometimes… it gets to you, ya know?

  46. Glutinous-Bicarbonate August 4, 2013 at 3:23 pm -      #646

    “Sometimes… it gets to you, ya know?”
    -
    Every franchise has its moments. The Star Wars Christmas Special, Jurassic Park III, Legolas’ ludicrous movie moments…
    -
    Buuuut, that sounds pretty bad, even compared to the rest.

  47. Sauroposeidon August 4, 2013 at 3:48 pm -      #647

    The Doomsday weapon doesn’t blow up planets. It carves them up with proton beams and sucks in the chunks to eat them. I just watched the episode. That is literally how it is described as acting. These last few weeks I’ve been going through the TOS some more. Actually almost to season 3.
    -
    Although in STO another turned half a moon in to debris with a single barrage of anti-proton beams.. but then there’s no way to know how big that moon actually was.

  48. VunderGuy August 4, 2013 at 6:52 pm -      #648

    Alright, so, what is the TNT output of the Enterprise in firepower on the high-end?

  49. rebel hunter 264 August 8, 2013 at 2:10 am -      #649

    For what it’s worth, the Enterprise D did use its phaser to drill to a planet’s core. I could take a crack at that calc, but uuunnnnghggghghgh

    last time I checked phasers could not even scratch pure neutronium and I will restate this again neutronium is apart of durasteel and for the photon torpedoes I’m sorry for my really poor description I had two sources that didn’t corroborate very well at all and would anti matter affect shields because anti matter only affects matter and energy can’t be destroyed or created and energy is what makes up shields this is just a question has nothing to do with the argument and I still think SSD would thrash enterprise D executor is just so large its total mass combined with the strength of the particle and ray shields I just can’t see anything happening considering I will restate this and you can quote me “It took an entire fleet of Mon calamari cruisers which are the equivalent to a heavy destroyer at point blank range out fitted with ion cannons which over load circuitry to one begin loosing one fight with one ship and two got almost nowhere until almost 3 quarters of the entire fleet if not more was wiped out (mind you the rebellion fleet is quite large fleet considering it was reinforced by almost every gang and cartel in the know galaxy and two is was able to stand up against the total size of the imperial fleet that was protecting the death star II which can be compared to the Second Fleet of Homogeneous Clarity from halo which is massive with probably the same amount of fire power if not more just from executor class SSD being apart of the fleet” in the time it would take for enterprise to have fired everything executor would have just blown enterprise out of the metaphorical “water” from one its sheer quantity of proton torpedoes which are used in orbital bombardment of a planet on capital ships which implies and increase in yield to accomplish such a feat second of proton torpedoes fire upon detonation protons at hyper sonic speeds causing a disruption of the molecular structure of the intended target depending on the size targets are essentially annihilated due to such disruption and have the ability in some series to be modified to increase maneuverability and control ability its also stated a proton torpedo can turn up to 90 degrees in an instant decreasing the odds to hit one drastically
    anyone who doesn’t believe me make sure to look up the book complete cross sections under the tie bomber and wookieepedia.

  50. StealthRanger August 8, 2013 at 2:14 am -      #650

    …… you realise nobody’s going to read that right?

  51. rebel hunter 264 August 8, 2013 at 2:21 am -      #651

    and I forgot this is the qauntity of armament and fighters

    Over 5,000 turbolaser batteries and ion cannons[3]
    2,000 turbolaser batteries[12]
    2,000 heavy turbolaser batteries[12]
    250 heavy ion cannons[12]
    500 point-defense laser cannons[12]
    250 heavy concussion missile batteries[5][7]
    40 Phylon Transport Q7 tractor beam projectors[7]
    Complement
    144 various TIE series starfighters[5]
    TIE/LN starfighters[4]
    TIE/sa bombers[4]
    TIE/In interceptors[4]
    TIE/D Defenders[13]
    TIE/ad starfighters[14]
    Darth Vader’s TIE Advanced x1[15]

    and for the uninformed Tie defenders are Tie advanced’s except in like a tri fang shape with shields, hyperdrive and

    SFS L-s9.3 laser cannons (4)[1]
    Borstel NK-3 medium ion cannons (2)[1]
    SFS M-g-2 general-purpose warhead launchers (2)[1]
    Standard load: 4 concussion missiles or proton torpedoes each[2]
    Tractor beam projector (1; optional)[2]
    quatity of the armament is the one closest to the name and are in brackets() the others that aren’t in brackets are for the site I got this off also for more of those numbers find the essential guide to warfare it will corroborate my statement.

  52. rebel hunter 264 August 8, 2013 at 2:22 am -      #652

    yeah I have nothing to do right now so meh

  53. rebel hunter 264 August 8, 2013 at 2:24 am -      #653

    StealthRanger
    were you on Sith vs the emperor from space marine discussion?

  54. mack006 August 8, 2013 at 2:45 am -      #654

    “…… you realise nobody’s going to read that right?”
    I JUST READ IT STEALTH RANGER >:)

  55. rebel hunter 264 August 10, 2013 at 9:18 pm -      #655

    well one person great work here’s your medal!

  56. GuardianAngel1911 the Ten Tails Jinchuriki August 10, 2013 at 9:29 pm -      #656

    @Rebel Hunter
    you’d do well to separate your paragraphs from now on.
    -
    with dashes like that
    =
    or equal signs
    /
    or really whatever symbol you feel best, just a friendly tip to help your arguments get read by some people and to make them look more organized.
    -
    That said welcome to BankGambling

  57. rebel hunter 264 August 10, 2013 at 10:01 pm -      #657

    yeah never was good at punctuation and spacing.

  58. rebel hunter 264 August 10, 2013 at 10:06 pm -      #658

    oh how rude of me forgot to add thanks for the tip guardian angel 1911

  59. GuardianAngel1911 the Ten Tails Jinchuriki August 10, 2013 at 10:08 pm -      #659

    No problem, just want to help you avoid comments like the above about no one going to read it.

  60. rebel hunter 264 August 11, 2013 at 5:53 am -      #660

    and is that fan art for your profile pic and how do you change profile pics I can’t seem to could you help me out thanks.

  61. StealthRanger August 11, 2013 at 8:50 am -      #661

    en.gravatar.com/

  62. rebel hunter 264 August 13, 2013 at 6:52 am -      #662

    k

  63. StealthRanger August 13, 2013 at 6:54 am -      #663

    …… seriously?

  64. rebel hunter 264 August 13, 2013 at 6:56 am -      #664

    what? is there an issue I’m to lazy to spell OK properly?

  65. Sauroposeidon August 13, 2013 at 7:03 am -      #665

    StealthRanger…you make me think of like “older, hipster Trowa”…

  66. StealthRanger August 13, 2013 at 7:03 am -      #666

    No, just how your response was just “k”. Which is the most annoying response ever

  67. StealthRanger August 13, 2013 at 7:04 am -      #667

    “StealthRanger…you make me think of like “older, hipster Trowa”…”
    -
    And why is that then hm?

  68. Sauroposeidon August 13, 2013 at 7:05 am -      #668

    Your picture does. It’s the hair. I don’t recognize him but he reminds me of Trowa.

  69. StealthRanger August 13, 2013 at 7:07 am -      #669

    Haha, but my pic is actually Slayer from Guilty Gear. I just liked this pic

  70. rebel hunter 264 April 2, 2014 at 5:22 pm -      #671

    Link primus Welcome to the party, your late by about 12 months

  71. Darth Sooqa June 3, 2014 at 5:23 am -      #672

    The only thing Enterprise could use for its advantage is its manueverability. BUT all Executor-class SSDs are armed with multiple tractor beam projectors, so Enterprise is vaporized in a few seconds after leaving the warp.
    So sad.

  72. Ian June 6, 2014 at 11:20 pm -      #673

    It depends on which Enterprise crew and who is on the SSD. TNG would be the only one that would stand a chance, and it would be from the capabilities of it’s crew rather than the ability to take on the overpowered SSD. The Enterprise has numerous advantages such as Picard’s handy tactical knowledge, Data’s ability to make near instantly quick decisions, and Diana’s ability to affect the minds of others.

    First, Picard would attempt to keep his ship as much out of harms way as possible. Hiding behind a planet would be the best thing here.

    Data could asses the situation and make piloting adjustments much faster than would be capable on the SSD.

    Diana could theoretically use her abilities in a “force-like” manner, and affect the ability of the crew on the SSD to engage the Enterprise effectively.

    And the TNG trump card. Though not an actual part of the ship, but something that comes along with having Picard as captain. Q. He is far too fond of Picard to let him go down in a noble fight against an enemy as powerful as the Empire.

    And since we are dealing with theoreticals now, we could entertain the idea that at some point in time, both TOS and TNG have travelled through time. in this scenario, they could both go back and prevent the takeover by Senator Palpatine, and therefore prevent the Empire from rising on the dark side to begin with. Once that is done, the argument becomes moot, as they would both be aligned on the same side of good vs evil.

    Now, how about the flying city of Atlantis from Stargate vs the SSD?

  73. Glutinous-Bicarbonate June 6, 2014 at 11:29 pm -      #674

    Outside help regarding Q and a lot of stretching what ifs.

  74. TheSorrow June 7, 2014 at 12:03 am -      #675

    Diana’s ability to affect the minds of others
    -
    Diana’s ability only affects those with similar traits.
    -
    Hiding behind a planet would be the best thing here.
    -
    What planet? The match description makes no indication of where in space this take place.
    -
    Diana could theoretically use her abilities in a “force-like” manner, and affect the ability of the crew on the SSD to engage the Enterprise effectively.
    -
    Read my first response.
    -
    And since we are dealing with theoreticals now, we could entertain the idea that at some point in time, both TOS and TNG have travelled through time. in this scenario, they could both go back and prevent the takeover by Senator Palpatine, and therefore prevent the Empire from rising on the dark side to begin with.
    -
    *Sigh* Uggghhhhh…. Okay so where to begin with this. In almost every instance of Picard and his crew going through time, it has been an accident, and not a technology they have had readily available. Not to mention they have no prior knowledge of Emperor Palpatine’s ascension into power.

  75. Jake_Uzumaki June 7, 2014 at 12:16 am -      #676

    Not to mention going back in time would likely ripple through the Force like Godzilla doing a cannon ball which would likely instantly alert every Jedi, Sith, and other Force user in the galaxy that something incredibly unnatural has happened, and there’s no telling what butterfly effect their travelling would have which could cause an even worse imbalance in the Force than was already present which could lead to someone far worse, far more powerful and far more sadistic than Palpatine rising eventually.
    -
    and that the rules say no going back before the start of the match…

  76. rebel hunter 264 June 7, 2014 at 6:34 am -      #677

    Also you do know that, if we’re running off the idea of these characters being present first you know that to disrupt imperial attention through essentially mental distraction is highly unlikely as it is stated in the thrawn trilogy that the emperor exerts a level of control over imperial forces throughout the galaxy, boosting their efficiency as after his deathly endor the imperial navy became disorganised leading to the fleets flagship perishing soon after also star fleet tactics aren’t fantastic in another discussion star fleet vs the covenant a guy pointed out their definition of tactics is line formations, taught as standard by at the academy, as towards Data’s existence meaning anything well it doesn’t as the empire has equally as capable 100% tactical droids that deal the exact way as data except purely for militaristic purposes also (note tactics are pretty pointless as stated before phasers can’t destroy neutronium which is a key element to durasteel the main metal used on all Star Wars craft so the only capable weapons they would be able to field are quantum and photon torpedoes now anti matter only causes damage to physical matter, which shields aren’t they are pure energy (which can’t be destroyed) so the only weapons capable of doing anything would be the quantum torpedoes but the sheer size of executor it would take a lot of torpedoes to lick the surface of executor let alone scratch it) also if I put a brackets inside brackets well meh I’m typing this from an ipod.

  77. rebel hunter 264 June 7, 2014 at 6:36 am -      #678

    Also why are you here? this page is dead

  78. rebel hunter 264 June 7, 2014 at 6:41 am -      #679

    Also Atlantis vs executor would be impossible Atlantis would kick ass since it’s weapons ignore shields

  79. JasterMareel June 8, 2014 at 5:44 pm -      #680

    After some intensive research on weapons quality -deflector shielding – tactical doctrine -encounter scenario- and pre war doctrine. I have to fall in favor of the ISD. I set a Nebula Class New Republic Star Destroyer versus a Sovereign Class Starship from Star Fleet. This ISD model has 40 quick recharge Heavy Turbolasers and 40 regular Turbolasers and supported by 20 Ion cannons–1 HTL emits/fires 2.8 million Terawatts / 6.7 gigatons explosive- 1 normal TL emits to destroy a 100 meter asteroid is 22500 TW /5.4 megatons explosive- Ion cannons fire electromagnetic particles that disrupt ship systems and also a known weakness to Federation shields. This star destroyer has reactor output of 9.28x10e24 or 92800000000 TW.

    A Sovereign Class Star Fleet vessel carries
    325 standard Photon Torpedoes
    Sources say yield is 18.5 isotons or 64.4 megatons equivalent

    175 standard Quantum Torpedoes
    256 megatons equivalent

    Possibly carries around 6 Tri Cobalt war head
    1610 megaton equivalent

    A Federation Warp core (newer) yields 12.75 gigawatts

    16 Type 12 Phaser Emitting Arrays
    Each array fires 1000 TW (2.39 megaton explosive)

    1st encounter would put the SC ship facing regular patrols of up to 20 ships . Federation ship will be told to stand by to be boarded for inspection to find contraband weapons. If the federation resisted- One broadside with HTL,TL, and Ion cannons disrupt the SC systems and knock out shielding. *Take note* transporters are ineffective during beginning of engagement and takes time to mod in order to break thru- time will be in extreme short supply. Troopers will overwhelm SC crew and take them into custody for questioning. All useful tech like transporters- replicators- star charts- tactical data- New Republic science reverse engineers to allow NRN ships to be fitted on current vessels.

    I could only verify approx 6300 commissioned ships in Star Fleet

    The federation has 158 member worlds with 1300 colonies

    The New Republic started with 11000. At its peak- they had 500,000 members. With only 2500 ships in their primary fleets. The New Republic squashes Federation.

  80. JasterMareel June 8, 2014 at 5:48 pm -      #681

    May I also point out that SSDs were phased out and that the galaxy class’ Type 10 phaser arrays wouldnt even tickle the SSD since the Type 10s destructive strength was only 5.1 megawatts

  81. JasterMareel June 8, 2014 at 5:53 pm -      #682

    The duratanium armor is upposed to contain neutronium which will act as a ablative effect vs energy weapons

  82. JasterMareel June 8, 2014 at 10:31 pm -      #683

    I made an error- my notes have 900TW for Federation Warp Core energy output not 12.75

  83. JasterMareel June 8, 2014 at 10:58 pm -      #684

    Please do not confuse Warp flight as being faster than hyperdrive. Hyperdrive allows vessels to slip into an extra dimensional hyperspace that allows ships to travel 100,000 times faster than light but is of limited use due constant changes in the galaxy Nav computers crunch calculations to avoid stars-planetary bodies – and gravity wells like black holes. Ships cannot be detected while in transit. The only warning star fleet gets is the unique Cronau radiation upon exiting hyperspace. ISDs would be catching star fleet off guard more often than not.

  84. JasterMareel June 8, 2014 at 11:09 pm -      #685

    I also would like some fallacies in mind cleared up- ramming into the bridge. In TESB – the ISD 1 was in the asteroid field for a day or two taking serious punishment according to the story line and In ROTJ in the Battle of Endor did everyone forget Admiral Ackbar concentrating fleet firepower on the SSD thus leaving it vulnerable at the time the A wing hit the bridge. Think about it. May I remind Federation shields are ineffective against asteroids which says a lot

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