Metal Sonic Vs Kharn the Betrayer

Metal Sonic Vs Kharn the Betrayer

Suggested by Sauroposeidon

Metal Sonic vs Kharn the Betrayer (Warhammer 40K)

Oh look, another Kharn match!

Coming at him at high speed is the nefarious Metal Sonic, looking to destroy the chaos champion because that’s the kind of guy Metal Sonic is.

They fight a top of a glacier at the top of the world. Only one survives. The mountain of ice cracks and shakes beneath the mighty energies being released. Only one will survive to see this through. The other will sink to a watery grave as their crumbling arena slips beneath the waves in so many pieces.

Who will win?

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41 Comments on "Metal Sonic Vs Kharn the Betrayer"

  1. pimpmage October 24, 2015 at 12:14 am -      #1

    What makes metal sonic different from the normal sonic?

  2. Hac148 October 24, 2015 at 12:52 am -      #2

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=qitt0AsCSYQ

    skip to 2:25 for the relevant details

  3. Sauroposeidon October 24, 2015 at 8:54 am -      #3

    When I suggest two things at once, I don’t expect both to make it.

    I dropped the Harry Dresden vs Metal Sonic match because I was literally the only person interested in debating Metal Sonic, I realized, after a point.

    Considering that, I don’t see this match getting very far since I tend to lose interest in a match that’s only me and one or two other guys.

    Feels too much like masturbating when I debate my own matches these days.

  4. shadowrider98 October 24, 2015 at 10:37 am -      #4

    @saurposeidon

    then count me in,I’ll take metal sonic’s side like last time.

    @pimpmage

    nothing really,metal sonic was built to be the very image of normal sonic(same skills,same personality,same speed etc.)


    @Hac148

    deathbattle is not a reliable source as they usually mess up on a bunch of stuff,the only reliable sources is this www.youtube.com/watch?v=-bIawOdFNu4 and the games and comics.

  5. Friendlysociopath October 24, 2015 at 11:35 am -      #5

    Well let’s see- how fast is Metal Sonic again?

  6. Sauroposeidon October 24, 2015 at 12:04 pm -      #6

    Metal Sonic is different in these areas:

    Metal Sonic is faster.

    Metal Sonic is more durable.

    Metal Sonic is not physically stronger, but has more varied attack options.

    Metal Sonic can heal faster than Sonic

    Metal Sonic has energy shields

    Metal Sonic can scan and copy the abilities of targets.

  7. pimpmage October 24, 2015 at 12:21 pm -      #7

    That scanning and copying of abilities .. could that be used on kharn?

  8. Friendlysociopath October 24, 2015 at 12:28 pm -      #8

    Metal Sonic is faster.

    Alright, but how fast is he?

    Metal Sonic is more durable.

    Alright, but how durable is he? Could he survive a hit from Kharn? Or being shot by Kharn?

    Metal Sonic is not physically stronger, but has more varied attack options.

    What are these? Will they break through the Spas Mareen armor?

    Metal Sonic can heal faster than Sonic

    Sonic can heal?

    Metal Sonic has energy shields

    What have they tanked in the past?

    Metal Sonic can scan and copy the abilities of targets.

    For Kharn that wouldn’t be much would it?

  9. shadowrider98 October 24, 2015 at 1:21 pm -      #9

    @friendly

    Alright, but how fast is he?

    he’s as fast as sonic

    Alright, but how durable is he? Could he survive a hit from Kharn? Or being shot by Kharn?

    he survived getting his bottom half sliced off and in the cartoon he survived very critical damage to his systems and he got part of the back of his head blown off but was still functional.

    What are these? Will they break through the Spas Mareen armor?

    he can shoot lasers from his chest as a ranged attack is one of them and I think they might be able to.

    Sonic can heal?

    yeah sonic can heal.

  10. Alpha or Omega October 24, 2015 at 2:33 pm -      #10

    I feel like Friendly was asking for specifics.
    /
    @Friendly
    “Alright, but how fast is he?”
    /
    As of Sonic Adventure Manual, hypersonic. Mach 5 at minimum.
    We don’t know how much faster they have gotten.
    /
    “Alright, but how durable is he? Could he survive a hit from Kharn? Or being shot by Kharn?”
    /
    For base Metal Sonic.
    Since he can take hypersonic rams and homing attacks from Sonic, yes.
    The amount of energy Sonic gives him can be given by
    KE=1/2 *m*v^2
    v=1715 m/s (mach 5)
    m=35 kg (Sonic’s mass)
    /
    So
    KE=1/2*(35kg)*(1715m/s)^2
    KE=51471437.5J
    That’s 51.47 megajoules.
    /
    Do note, that this is only accounting for Sonic Ramming at these speeds at Metal
    This is not accounting for Sonic’s spin attack while attacking Metal Sonic
    youtu.be/EYW7-hNXZlM?t=55
    The spin attack allows him to cut and drill through several large boulders.
    This is the same attack he uses when ramming at Metal Sonic.
    So, it would be more than 51.47 megajoules since my calculation didn’t account for Sonic’s spin attack.
    /
    “What are these? Will they break through the Spas Mareen armor?”
    /
    Most likely since Metal Sonic is a metallic copy of Sonic.
    He even has the same things as Sonic.
    Spin dash, spin attack, homing attack, and the lightspeed dash attack.
    That’s where Sonic and Metal Sonic’s similarity ends.
    youtu.be/Qp5sAPGbGYA?t=861
    Metal Sonic can shoot electrical energy attacks as well as overloading his Fusion reactor to gain faster speeds as well as gain an energy field which does more damage.
    /
    “Sonic can heal?”
    /
    In Sonic Battle, he could, but I don’t remember Metal Sonic doing the same.
    /
    “What have they tanked in the past?”
    /
    Well, Base Metal Sonic himself can tank some hits from Sonic.
    The energy shield themselves allow complete invulnerability to the attacks (Base)Sonic and the gang throws out
    /
    “For Kharn that wouldn’t be much would it?”
    /
    Metal Sonic is able to copy moves from both organic and machinery.
    Whether it’s physical, chaos energy, telekinesis(IIRC), and whatever the watery Chaos is.
    I know a plasma pistol could be within his limit, but the Gorechild isn’t

  11. pimpmage October 24, 2015 at 3:09 pm -      #11

    Didn’t someone calc the force of an impact with a bolt round as well as the power of the explosives within on this site before? I can’t recall the name of the match. Kharns armor only takes chips from space marine bolter shells.

  12. Alpha or Omega October 24, 2015 at 4:34 pm -      #12

    www.factpiletopia.com/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=148692
    71.289 kilojoules.

  13. Dmtl October 24, 2015 at 4:39 pm -      #13

    Sauro…why you do dis… I can’t see how Kharn can win this one since sonic can just run on water if arena crumbles..also Kharn is basically counting on a lucky hit..

  14. pimpmage October 24, 2015 at 5:01 pm -      #14

    That’s only from the energy from the impact alpha. Not the explosive within too. There was a BankGambling match that measured explosive force too.

  15. Alpha or Omega October 24, 2015 at 5:14 pm -      #15

    That’s the only calculation that I have seen for the bolter so far.
    I don’t recall any matches that calculated the explosive energy of the bolter, but I’ll try.

  16. pimpmage October 24, 2015 at 5:32 pm -      #16

    Do you need me to find quotes on the explosive power of a bolt?

  17. Alpha or Omega October 24, 2015 at 5:41 pm -      #17

    By try, I meant to try and find the calculation.
    Sorry.

  18. Dmtl October 24, 2015 at 6:34 pm -      #18

    Actually I just thought of another method Kharn could use to win…just blast holes on the ice all around him

  19. Alpha or Omega October 24, 2015 at 6:46 pm -      #19

    I quit. I can’t find it.
    /
    @Dmtl
    “Actually I just thought of another method Kharn could use to win…just blast holes on the ice all around him”
    /
    …Metal Sonic can fly.

  20. Mea quidem sententia October 24, 2015 at 9:16 pm -      #20

    Metal Sonic is 125.2 kg. At the speed of sound, he’d generate 7.4 MJ. At Mach 5, 184 MJ, which is equal to 44 kilograms of TNT.

  21. Sauroposeidon October 24, 2015 at 11:59 pm -      #21

    “Sauro…why you do dis… I can’t see how Kharn can win this one since sonic can just run on water if arena crumbles..also Kharn is basically counting on a lucky hit..”

    I was just trying to create a battlefield similar to the final battle between Sonic and Metal in the OAV is all.

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=3bEuwotzuVs

    “Metal Sonic is 125.2 kg. At the speed of sound, he’d generate 7.4 MJ. At Mach 5, 184 MJ, which is equal to 44 kilograms of TNT.”

    Seems about right from the anime, guesstimating. Might actually look up explosive videos to find out what that actually looks like, though.

  22. Dmtl October 25, 2015 at 1:15 am -      #22

    OMG I actually watched that video and I take it back, Kharn can def win because Metal Sonic is dumb as f***….also omg I watched that video…

  23. shadowrider98 October 25, 2015 at 7:34 am -      #23

    @Dmtl

    “OMG I actually watched that video and I take it back, Kharn can def win because Metal Sonic is dumb as f***….also omg I watched that video…”

    metal being dumb in that video is just PIS and he is a lot smarter than that,he was able to outsmart every one in the sonic universe multiple times,even eggman and tails who are considered as the smarties beings in the sonic universe got outsmarted by him,so he’s not as dumb as you think he his.

  24. Sauroposeidon October 25, 2015 at 7:56 am -      #24

    Well, they beat Metal by literally fucking with his head. He couldn’t even think straight after a while and eventually believed that he was actually Sonic when he decided to kill himself.

    Which is.. surprisingly dark for what, up until that moment, had been a very light hearted and cute cartoon. Speaks a bit on Sonic’s personality.. but, I am getting off course here.

    In the game canon I don’t think they ever do this to him, but he also doesn’t have the perpetual link to Sonic either so they simply can’t. In the anime he was using sonic’s brain to know how to fight, reacting instantly to his thoughts and mimicking his fighting style. This is not a feature present in any other incarnation.

    Even if it were, I don’t think it’d be a useful point for either side in this fight since tails and sonic aren’t present.

  25. shadowrider98 October 25, 2015 at 10:17 am -      #25

    I still think he takes this though

  26. the watcher October 25, 2015 at 4:53 pm -      #26

    You guys do realize that Kharn can breathe underwater, right?

  27. Mea quidem sententia October 25, 2015 at 5:15 pm -      #27

    @the watcher
    Even if Kharn can, it doesn’t mean anything if he’s stuck.

  28. Neon Lord October 25, 2015 at 5:54 pm -      #28

    “You guys do realize that Kharn can breathe underwater, right?”

    Space Marines can’t breath underwater. They are not fish. Maybe he has a limited internal air supply is what you are trying to get across.

  29. pimpmage October 25, 2015 at 5:56 pm -      #29

    I wouldn’t be so sure mea. He has holes in his armor specifically for letting his blood flow easier. And he is missing some sections of Armor. He might still drown. Sm’s 99% of the time are nowhere near water.

    There is a case of a SM company fighting on the sea Floor of a world for a few months. And there is a bamf chapter who specializes in underwater estate.

  30. pimpmage October 25, 2015 at 6:07 pm -      #30

    *combat not estate, that would be silly.

  31. the watcher October 25, 2015 at 6:14 pm -      #31

    “Space marines can’t breath underwater”

    Yes they can. The multi lung works for that in addition to the air filtration. This is assuming the multi lung is working, but Kharn is from the first founding and so there’s no reason why his wouldn’t be.

  32. Mea quidem sententia October 25, 2015 at 8:17 pm -      #32

    @pimpmage
    I’ll take your word.

  33. Dmtl October 25, 2015 at 8:56 pm -      #33

    Space Marines CANNOT breath underwater. Case in point from 2 books. Iron Snakes and the HH book I believe Fulgrim. They can last LONGER underwater but cannot breath underwater.
    ———————–
    Kharn also does not have a full power armour suit like most SM’s.

  34. Sauroposeidon October 25, 2015 at 10:08 pm -      #34

    …Can he not swim?

  35. Dmtl October 25, 2015 at 11:00 pm -      #35

    He can…I assume.

  36. the watcher October 25, 2015 at 11:11 pm -      #36

    @dmtl

    The Iron Snakes are a bad example because they’re of a later founding when most chapters had a broken geneseed. I’ll need quotes from fulgrim, but the codex rather explicitly states that they can breathe underwater just fine.

  37. Alpha or Omega October 25, 2015 at 11:35 pm -      #37

    Question.
    Dear Gentlemen, why are you mentioning the Marines’ ability to breath underwater or sink/swim in water when no one said Metal Sonic would win by sinking Kharn in the water?

  38. pimpmage October 25, 2015 at 11:57 pm -      #38

    Embarrassing way to die i guess?

    Anyway, sonic’s collision force was calculated to 44kg worth of tnt. Here is a video of 40kg tnt.
    youtu.be/WvlEVTF524U?t=36

    And here is a feat showing horus heresy era power armor resilience:

    “Giant forks of lightning, savage and yellow-white phosphorescent, were searing down into the open space, explosively scorching the earth. Though each fork only existed for a nanosecond, they seemed solid and real, like fundamental, physical structures, like upturned, thorny trees. Three Astartes, including Lucius, were struck. Secure in their Mark IV plate, they shrugged off the massive, detonating impacts and laughed as aftershock electrical blooms crackled like garlands of blue wire around their armour for a few seconds.” / Horus Rising, p.370 – **

    The storm above grew still more ferocious. Five more men were struck. One of them, Ulzoras, was actually knocked off his feet. They saw fused, glassy craters in the ground where lightning had earthed with the force of penetrator missiles. The shield-storm seemed to be pressing down on them, like a lid across the sky, pressurising the air, and squeezing them in an atmospheric vice.”[/i] / Horus Rising, p.371 – **

    And for reference, a penetrator missile in 40k is a weapon held by 40k fighter jets like the ‘lightning’.
    www.cold-moon.com/40k/Miniatures/HeresyEra/ThousandSonsV2/Lightning/PrimarisLightningPiP%20(8).jpg

    Looks to be an average looking fighter jet missile.

  39. Ninja Lowk October 26, 2015 at 12:48 am -      #39

    @Alpha
    BankGambling: where any detail, regardless of relevance, can sidetrack a debate.

  40. Dmtl October 26, 2015 at 2:54 am -      #40

    I take that back on the Fulgrim part just re-read the attack on Laeran and though they mention underwater cities they do not mention underwater combat. So Iron Snakes will do unless you can find your quote in the codex?

  41. pimpmage October 26, 2015 at 3:01 am -      #41

    Some various space marines fight off a tyranid kraken like bioform that attached itself to a submarine they were using while deep in an ocean. This was in the second story of the second blood angels omnibus I believe…

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