Hunt for Mages

Hunt for mages

Suggested by Rookie

Team mages: Ahriman (Warhammer 40K), Dyrr (Forgotten Realms), Voldemort (Harry Potter) and Ganondorf (LOZ: Twilight Princess version).

Team mercenary: Deathstroke (DC, have his standard ranged weapons, armor and his new God-Killer Sword), Captain Cold (pre-new 52, have his standard gear), Deadpool (Marvel) and Taskmaster (have his standard gear).

Team vampires: Kain and Raziel (Legacy of Kain, both at their strongest), Dracula (Castlevania: Lords of Shadow, end of the second game version) and Rayne (BloodRayne).

Team magical beings: Last Dragonborn (TES, end game version), Gandalf the White (LOTR), Lord Vile (Skulduggery Pleasant) and Lich King Arthas (World of Warcraft)

Team techno: JC Denton (Deus Ex, end game version with all his weapons from the game), Ultron (movie version, final body), Vision (Avengers movie version) and T-3000 (Terminator)

Restriction: no mind control abilities allowed.

Contest is simple. Team mages trying to stay alive and defeat other teams without leaving the castle area, while other teams hunt them. They can work together or they might hunt each other from the start this part is for them to decide. If they manage to kill all members of mages team a golden medal will appear on the battlefield. Team that managed to take this medal back to it’s starting point will win.

Battlefield: Dracula’s castle from Castlevania: Curse of Darkness.

Team mages starts in the final boss area.

Team mercenary starts before the entrance into castle.

Team vampires starts in Eneomaos Machine Tower (in the place where was a boss battle against Saint Germain)

Team magical beings starts in Aiolon Ruins.

Team techno starts in Garibaldi Temple (in where Hector faced Trevor Belmont).

Golden medal appears in Baljhet Mountains (in the place of Wyvern boss fight)

Dracula’s castle still infest with monsters, who are hostile towards all team.

So who will win in the end? Will it be one the hunters teams? Or maybe mages will win? Or maybe they will all fall to monsters?

 

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346 Comments on "Hunt for Mages"

  1. Blaze July 26, 2015 at 4:39 am -      #1

    I don’t know much about the rest of the teams but team magical being is just strong.The dragonborn just needs to use the unreleting force or dragon summon shouts and this battle is won.You know unreleting force in lore is strong enough to devestate huge cities.

    In WoW you only had the chance to kill Arthas because he was testing you all,but otherwise he simply 1 hitted you all.In lore he and ner’zhul was strong enough together to rebel againts the burning legion.

    I do not remember too much of the Lord of The rings movies, but i know thath that gandalf is a strong foe.


    Team techno:JC is very cool and strong and he has cool sunglasses and augmented vision.But i don’t think he stands much chance againts the others.I’d love to see him win,but i can’t sorry.Maybe with the terminator it will be good…

    T-3000:He is a super cool assasin robot with big guns,i think with comboed with JC they would be cool but otherwise nah.

    Team mages:I do not know anything about them why I feel that they will be incredibly overpowered and only the superheroes stand chance againts them because the many i win buttons?


    The ones who i didn1t wrote about is because i do not know anything about them.Untel then i vote for team magical beings.

  2. Commander Cross July 26, 2015 at 5:04 am -      #2

    Do All Sides need Armies for a fight like this, by chance?

    Also, Lord Vile has a ‘God-Killer Sword’ of his own if we’re using EoS Lord Vile, any time before that is fair game though.
    Then again he’s no one Dracul can’t fight and I can’t recall how well Kain vs Hellsing’s Alucard went, but my gut says it’s gonna affect Kain’s odds against a Max Power’ed Lord Vile.

    Never got to see The Age of Ultron so from what I recall, the T-3000 and JC Denton are gonna be the Biggest Threats from Team Techno at the moment.

    It’s possible to take the Playable!-Dragonborn/Last Dragonborn by surprise with the right Combat Tactics, I’ve no idea how Dyrr stacks up next to everyone else but I know Ahriman from what I recall of him’s no wuss.

    Isn’t Gandalf influenced by Odin the last I checked?

    This may boil down to how Tactical and/or Strategic both sides happen to be to say the least, bonus points if Armies are allowed and they can use them.

  3. Rookie July 26, 2015 at 5:11 am -      #3

    @Commander Cross

    “Also, Lord Vile has a ‘God-Killer Sword’ of his own if we’re using EoS Lord Vile, any time before that is fair game though.”

    Yes I tried made to sure that there is enough exotic stuff around this battle so that there was a chance to kill any character for everyone.

    “Do All Sides need Armies for a fight like this, by chance?”

    No armies for anyone, unless they can summon\made them.

    “Never got to see The Age of Ultron so from what I recall”

    Here Ultron vs Thor with fake voice acting:

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=VskDkcAB6f4

    And here is Ultron barely survives attacks from Vision, Thor and iron Man:

  4. AbsoluteZero July 26, 2015 at 5:12 am -      #4

    Rayne could be interesting. I might have to boot up Bloodrayne 2 in order to give her feats a look. Off the top of my head, she’s a casual bullet-timer. That said, I’m feeling like she won’t be anywhere near powerful enough to be useful here.

    Voldemort doesn’t seem to be very useful either. Spell time has always been a failing of Harry Potter, and even Voldemort doesn’t change it. He’s stated numerous times to know all sorts of evil magic, but he never really uses any.

  5. Friendlysociopath July 26, 2015 at 9:21 am -      #5

    Spell time has always been a failing of Harry Potter, and even Voldemort doesn’t change it.

    Always and forever will I lament what Harry Potter started as and could’ve been, JK just couldn’t stick to magic being magical and instead made spells glorified gunshots.

    That said- Team Mage has a D&D guy; the longer he’s around the harder it’s going to be to pry him out of there.
    Also, Mea calculated Kain’s durability to be slightly less stellar than Kitten did- to the point of a 9mm being able to work on him.

  6. Neon Lord July 26, 2015 at 9:29 am -      #6

    I’m inclined to go with Team Techno because on average they are quite tougher than the other hunter teams, and have a major advantage in the ranged department (ranged magic aside). Both Ultron and Vision can also fly, which is a major perk.

    The problem with group matches like this though is that the result can also vastly change depending on what strategies each team actually goes for, and who encounters who first.

    One team can simply camp the area where the medal appears, and wait for the other teams to clean out the mages before nabbing the medal and getting back to their spawn first.

  7. Amm0vamp1r3 July 26, 2015 at 10:45 am -      #7

    Kain, Raziel, Dracula and Rayne

    Well Rayne is a casual bullet timer so she’s the fastest

    Dracula and Kain can teleport so that’s travel right there

    Raziel, well idk what he brings but hey as long a there are dead bodies on the field he can keep coming back

  8. Spectral Observer July 26, 2015 at 11:08 am -      #8

    “What the hell? This isn’t my castle!”
    – Dracul

  9. pimpmage July 26, 2015 at 11:16 am -      #9

    For fucks sakes, this website just ate my comment. Goddammit.

    Essentially, we can power scale ahriman because he is much less known than other figures. Ahriman beat a squad of Eldar harlequins without armor, using just his staff. That very squad of Eldar absolutely massacred and speed blitzed a squad of deathwatch space marines earlier in the book. Ahriman’s specialty with warp powers is precognition and future sight, or divination.

  10. Blaze July 26, 2015 at 12:47 pm -      #10

    Hey my frined romans…Did you forgot abour the unreleting force could simply demolish cities?Like this but stronger:

    www.youtube.com/watch?v=WflEKJg1SXw

    And actually he can stop time.

    And yes T-3000 and JC are hell strong i’m just replaying deus ex,and i know how thoug he could be.


    Arthas could win using the 1-win button frostmourne hungers…

  11. Kitten Lord July 26, 2015 at 12:53 pm -      #11

    Mind posting the source for the shout being able to bust cities?

    I do not need to say who Ill be arguing for….

  12. Amm0vamp1r3 July 26, 2015 at 1:01 pm -      #12

    Pretty sure Kain has fought both the dragonborn and Ganon before on this site

  13. Kitten Lord July 26, 2015 at 1:11 pm -      #13

    Which reminds me I could have sworn we made a list of BankGambling awards. Rookie didnt you say you would post them to admin?

  14. Rookie July 26, 2015 at 1:19 pm -      #14

    @Kitten Lord

    “Rookie didnt you say you would post them to admin?”

    I asked him if I can make awards or no last time when it was time for him to send me new suggestions. He send me suggestions but didn’t replied about award thing so far.

  15. Spectral Observer July 26, 2015 at 1:47 pm -      #15

    Team (mostly) vamp should have a head start. To my knowledge, they have at least two teleporters in the form of Dracul and Kain to scout out the area and remain hidden from sight. Both Raziel and Dracul have abilities that render them invisible, as does Kain I think, if his mist form works that way.

    Dracul will find the castle very different from his own, but will likely look for the throne room right away to see who commands the castle. Since that is where the mages are stationed, all the better. It’s in Belmont M.O. to head straight to the throne room, and since Dracul can fly too, he can cut the distractions and head straight to the mages. I don’t know how Raziel and Rayne can follow, but Dracul and Kain will be able to fight the mages shortly after the match starts. They’ve already made a good team in the last match they were in, so how tough are their targets? I can tell that Voldemort is going to get gibbed the instant he’s spotted.

  16. Kitten Lord July 26, 2015 at 1:59 pm -      #16

    @Rookie

    “I asked him if I can make awards or no last time when it was time for him to send me new suggestions. He send me suggestions but didn’t replied about award thing so far.”

    Ah ok, do you remebmer which ones Kain was labeled as being awarded? Same question to you too Ammo, maybe ill just email Admin directly with them since I spoke to him recently.

    @Spectral

    ” so how tough are their targets?”

    I think Kain won against Ganondorf and like you said Voldemort is not much of an issue.

    I honestly do not have much faith in Dyr, but Ahriman? he “could” be an issue. Not sure.

    I think Kain could wait until all the teams are in the room. Then inspire hate/conflict reaver unless that consists as mind control.

    Kain has mind control but inspire hate does not control minds, it just makes you hate everyone to death apart from Kain.

  17. Amm0vamp1r3 July 26, 2015 at 2:06 pm -      #17

    Kains awards are:

    Razil and Kain vs Link and Ganon

    Dracula and Kain vs Dragon Born, Chosen Undead and Garret Hawke

    Vampires vs Symbiotes (also not sure 100%)

    Vampires vs Mages

    Kain vs Percy Jackson

    Kain vs Kratos

  18. Kitten Lord July 26, 2015 at 2:16 pm -      #18

    Thankies.

  19. Mea quidem sententia July 26, 2015 at 3:14 pm -      #19

    You know, when we examine the cube that Raziel pierces his claws into, we’ve assumed that the cube had a hardness number, rather than taking Raziel’s striking strength and determining it that way. Raziel’s arm is 0.83114444444444453024 meters long. When he pulls back his arm, it appears to cover double his arm length, giving us a distance of 1.66228888888888906048 meters.

    As for the time it took, I slowed down the time by a quarter. The time was 267 milliseconds, so a quarter of that would be 66.75 milliseconds.

    I will need to know the time it took for Raziel’s claws to come to a complete stop after striking the cube. Raziel’s claws are 69 pixels long, and his height is 720 pixels tall, so that would mean his claws would be 18.499666666666660232 cm. long. As for Raziel’s arm, the total arm is at least 5.7% of the mass of a human body. The average mass of an adult male is 70 kg., but Raziel doesn’t look like he’s 70 kg. 60 kg. might have to do.

    60 * 0.057 = 3.42 kg. We could also add an additional 300 grams, since that’s the average mass of an adult male’s hand. So we have 3.72 kg. Since we have the distance and time it took for Raziel to strike the cube, we can find out by dividing 1.66228888888888906048 m. over 66.75 ms, which is equal to 24.9032043279234316176779 m/s. This is much faster than the strike Raziel does against Kain in the introduction of Soul Reaver 2.

    Since we have the mass and velocity, this means that Raziel would deliver 92.639920099875165617761788 newton seconds. To find the force, we would need to divide this over time. To do that, I need to take the distance Raziel’s claws traveled and divide it by the speed. 18.499666666666660232 cm. / 24.9032043279234316176779 m/s = 7.428629032258061165 ms.

    Now that we have this information, we can take the force and divide it by the time. 92.639920099875165617761788 newton seconds / 7.428629032258061165 ms = 12,470.6617732014609 newtons. This is approximately 1.3 times the bite force of a large (12 ft.) American alligator. Let’s find out the pressure. Raziel’s claws are 4.557888888888886744 cm^2. The method Kitten Lord used for Brinell’s hardness test was that the tip of the claws diameter was equal to that of the diameter of the finger. So I’ll do this here.

    12470.6617732014609 N / 45.57888888888886744 mm^2 = 273.60609433902928 MPa. From this information, Brinell’s hardness number (BHN) is 0.38969199102353. Steel is 130.

  20. Blaze July 26, 2015 at 3:17 pm -      #20

    Shouts in lore are much more devastiting,as noted even in morrowind that a thuu’m master in the first era devasteted a city.The the way of the voice wqas founded.Imagine what is the dragonborn capeble of then.

  21. Rookie July 26, 2015 at 4:48 pm -      #21

    Some feats for Ahriman:

    “‘Do you know why Ahriman gave you to me?’

    Hemellion shook his head without looking up. In fact he was not sure why he was having this conversation.

    ‘He gave you to me because he thought that of all my brothers I am the one who needs another serf. The others can break apart their armour with a thought, remake the atoms in the air, unmake the light that meets their eyes. I…’ Hemellion looked up. Sanakht was turning the cup in his hand, watching the liquid cling to the silver. ‘I cannot. Not without great effort, not any more.’ ”

    “The warp fire engulfed Ahriman. He felt it flow over his armour and skin. He felt the runes etched in his armour twist, felt his bones judder inside his flesh. His mind was tumbling away from his body, burning and melting like a ball of wax in a furnace. The bloody silk of his robe whipped in the gale as the fire reached up to cradle him. Tendrils of flame wormed across his body, writhing across the stump of his arm and the gouges in his flesh. Flesh bubbled up in the wounds, before armour spread across them like liquid. ”

    “Cendrion’s sword cut through the spiral of shadow. The mass of wings parted like a slit sheet of silk. Ahriman felt the pain of the cut, felt the Grey Knight’s will pouring into the blade. But he was ready. The Grey Knight was strong, strong in ways that he had never imagined, but he was like his sword, a weapon, and that focus made him blind. Ahriman focused his whole mind for an instant. Cendrion’s sword shattered. Silver fragments spun through the air.

    He felt the Grey Knight’s shock. He almost smiled. Then the flock of shadow birds tore through Cendrion. Wards woven into the silver armour held and then cracked. Splinters of ceramite tore into Cendrion’s muscles. A wall of telekinetic force lifted him from the floor, spinning his bulk like a dry leaf. Polished plates buckled and tore. Ragged edges of metal punctured his flesh. Bones in his chest and arms shattered. Warning chimes sang from around his collar. His flesh burned as warding runes melted on the inside of his armour. Liquid silver dripped from the Grey Knight as he fell.

    Ahriman pulled his dispersed mind back together, feeling the substance of his body flickering back into reality.

    He looked down at Cendrion.

    His right heart beat once.”

  22. Ninja Lowk July 26, 2015 at 5:41 pm -      #22

    “Imagine what is the dragonborn capeble of then.”

    Don’t have to imagine. He has visible feats. The worst he’s done with his shouts is send giants flying.
    ===
    Was voldy immortal? How exactly did his work.

  23. Kitten Lord July 26, 2015 at 6:03 pm -      #23

    @mea

    “we’ve assumed that the cube had a hardness number,”

    Because a cube of metal or stone does have a hardness number.

    “rather than taking Raziel’s striking strength”

    This makes no sense, I think your trying to argue that a character with super strength “has” to move their arms with mass and velocity to achieve force, clearly not true with Raziel.


    “This is approximately 1.3 times the bite force of a large (12 ft.) American alligator”

    This is where you should have stopped and realized even a large alligator is not going to be able to dig a large hand sized hole in a hunk of stone or steel….

    Then reconsider your logic and gone back to what we were doing before, actually calculating super human strength. not human strength….

    Mea how much force does it take, or pressure to disintegrate stone?

  24. Amm0vamp1r3 July 26, 2015 at 6:09 pm -      #24

    So no mind control but what about full body control because Dracula can control people by making them swallow his blood

  25. Mea quidem sententia July 26, 2015 at 8:25 pm -      #25

    @Kitten Lord
    Since wrought iron is the iron understood by us westerners, and since it was very common, we could say these cubes are made of wrought iron, which would mean it has an ultimate tensile strength of 234 to 372 MPa, compression strength ranging between 234 to 372 MPa, a shear strength of 193 to 310 MPa.

    Since the method I’m using to find pressure is no different from finding these, my calculation does not contradict 273.60 MPa. Wrought iron is both malleable and ductile. My calculation is valid. On the other hand, you haven’t disproved my last post or the numbers. You simply doubted.

  26. Friendlysociopath July 26, 2015 at 8:46 pm -      #26

    Hmm, while Raziel’s body can be destroyed his spirit form will simply persist unless someone has attacks that can harm/trap the soul. I see some of that is available among the teams but it’s still going to be hard to keep him down- especially since the castle is literally full of potential bodies for him to resurrect into.

    So quick question- what all monsters are in this Dracula’s Castle? And are any of them likely to be a problem for various characters?

  27. Amm0vamp1r3 July 26, 2015 at 8:57 pm -      #27

    castlevania.wikia.com/wiki/Curse_of_Darkness_Bestiary

  28. Soulerous July 26, 2015 at 9:05 pm -      #28

    Hmm, while Raziel’s body can be destroyed his spirit form will simply persist unless someone has attacks that can harm/trap the soul.
    -He doesn’t happen to have feats of resisting manipulation while in spirit form, does he? Because Arthas and Frostmourne are going to be a pretty rude awakening if he doesn’t.

  29. Mea quidem sententia July 26, 2015 at 9:05 pm -      #29

    Possession of new bodies would require Raziel to become familiar with these, and considering the ones here can rid of these monsters, the death of Raziel will remain a loss. Dracula can also soul steal.

  30. Amm0vamp1r3 July 26, 2015 at 9:11 pm -      #30

    -He doesn’t happen to have feats of resisting manipulation while in spirit form, does he? Because Arthas and Frostmourne are going to be a pretty rude awakening if he doesn’t.

    I don’t believe he does, his physical form gets destroyed and then he goes to the spectral realm. No kind of manipulation to deal with thus no feats, that I can remember

    Dracula can also soul steal.

    Wrong Dracula and he’s also on Raziels team

    Possession of new bodies would require Raziel to become familiar with these

    Familiar with what exactly?

  31. Friendlysociopath July 26, 2015 at 9:25 pm -      #31

    Figures there’s a lot of them haha- guess I’ll start looking to see if any potent entries strike me as notable.

    Was voldy immortal?

    Not the useful kind, if you kill his body he simply becomes “less than a ghost” until he’s resurrected. Although to be fair, apparently the “hard part” was getting Harry- Voldemort could’ve come back in other ways, he just really wanted Harry.

    Seriously though, Dyr is going to pose a major threat to a lot of people; especially if he can sit tight for a few minutes to set up defenses.
    Let’s see, they still haven’t got around to making 5e characters have they? Till then I’ll post what I know of Dyr.

    Abilities
    Fear Aura: Just being near him can unnerve people
    Drow Traits: Dyrr is immune to magic sleep spells and effects.
    Paralyzing Touch: Any living creature Dyrr strikes with his touch attack may be permanently paralyzed.
    Undead Traits: This is a really long list so I’ll condense it- no mind spells work on him, he has no vitals to strike, nor can you sap his strength or health by magical means.

    Spells
    Cleric – He mostly keeps a ton of slots so he can heal himself with negative energy; but he’s also got some domain spells: Death (death touch 1/day), Undeath (free Extra Turning feat).
    Sorceror – acid splash, daze, detect magic, disrupt undead, ghost sound, light, mage hand, read magic, resistance;
    color spray, detect secret doors, magic missile, ray of enfeeblement, shield;
    alter self, invisibility, resist energy, scorching ray, see invisibility;
    dispel magic, fly, haste, lightning bolt;
    detect scrying enervation, greater invisibility, polymorph;
    cone of cold, hold monster, summon monster V, teleport;
    analyze dweomer, circle of death, true seeing;
    finger of death, limited wish, plane shift;
    horrid wilting, mind blank, summon monster VIII; energy drain, imprisonment, wish

    Damn D&D characters get a lot of shit
    Equipment
    Crown of Sorcerous Terror – Allows him to absorb any magic cast against him.
    Dyrr’s Impervious Vestment – Stronger than plate mail, also can cast Blade Barrier centered on itself
    Spiteful Imp – Animated buckler that protects him by itself
    Staff of Mastery – Gives him some more spells: Hold person (1 charge)
    Dimensional anchor (1 charge)
    Repulsion (2 charges)
    Dominate monster (3 charges)

    If anyone wants to know what those spells do just ask.

  32. Mea quidem sententia July 26, 2015 at 9:30 pm -      #32

    Ah. I would say becoming familiar in a new body.

  33. Karen Starr July 26, 2015 at 9:46 pm -      #33

    Could Dyrr use his magic to control the vampires? I know there is some spells plus he can do the command undead thing instead of turning them, though I think the only one potentially weak enough would be Rayne. Though it would be hilarious if he fucking turns them instead of controls, and just vaporizes them on the spot.

  34. Mea quidem sententia July 26, 2015 at 9:47 pm -      #34

    Anyway, since defeating Marcus only resulted in acquiring a charm ability, Kain isn’t that durable, as he wears iron armor forged in hellfire. This armor of his when he was a human adds protection, but having been forged in hellfire adds a fire-resistant perk. Or maybe it’s just that way because iron has a high melting point. Raziel’s claws should be enough to penetrate wought iron.

  35. AbsoluteZero July 26, 2015 at 9:52 pm -      #35

    Voldemort is mage team cannon fodder. First to die, easily. His horcruxes would keep him ‘alive’ but, he’d be out of the fight for decades. So, may as well consider him down for the count.

    As for abilities he’s displayed, it really all comes down to the killing curse. While this -may- work on the various enemies, I don’t actually think he’d pull off successfully hitting anyone. Voldemort can fly unaided, but, I don’t see this doing him much good either. He can teleport via disapparation, which would probably be his best tactic, spring up behind someone and insta-kill them.

    Voldemort can also revive the dead, in a state refered to as Inferi. Mindless shambling corpses that are an issue for literally nobody in this fight.

    For all the hype he got, he doesn’t really have many feats. He is stated to be a master of mind-raping though, but once again, we never actually see him do it. The best feats we have of him are his fight, in the movies, against Dumbledore.

    youtu.be/URbvT_pkAjI

    Which does display him using telekinesis quite effectively. First disarming harry when he appears, and then lifting all the shattered glass in the room. He just lacks the speed to be of any use. Unless he teleported around constantly while blasting killing curses, which would have varying levels of effectiveness against his enemies.

  36. Friendlysociopath July 26, 2015 at 9:55 pm -      #36

    Could Dyrr use his magic to control the vampires?

    In theory, they’d need feats against mind control or something.

    Who on the various other teams can see through illusions and invisibility? This is literally the favorite thing for a Lich, a castle full of monsters and people trying to kill him.

  37. GrandMaster July 26, 2015 at 11:09 pm -      #37

    Are any of the hunters noted as being particularly fast? Because Ahriman can speed blitz even space marines.

  38. Karen Starr July 26, 2015 at 11:28 pm -      #38

    Capt. Cold apparently trained himself to be able to react to Flash. Though I doubt it’s full speed Flash. The rest are easily bullet timers/ peak human+

  39. Shadow-Knight July 27, 2015 at 1:20 am -      #39

    Ok so, the T-3000 is basically a T-1000 on roids. Unless someone is packing electro magnetic weapons or can banish it from existence its going to murder anyone who gets in melee range,.

  40. Spectral Observer July 27, 2015 at 1:40 am -      #40

    Dracul on resisting vampiric glamouring/mind control:
    ===
    “The Butcher who commanded the castle kitchens feeds the corpses of the dead to the Ghouls. The efficiency of the Queen’s household is formidable indeed. The vampires drain the blood and the Ghouls feed on the remains, nothing is left. Using his powers is making Gabriel far stronger than I anticipated. He will need more than physical prowess when he faces her. She can put a glamour upon his heart that will tempt him to forget everything he knows, even his beloved. She holds the next piece of the mask, and I fear that he will fall at the last.”
    – Lords of Shadow chapter 7-1
    ===
    The blood of Olrox has opened the way to the Queen. She holds the next piece of the God mask, which Gabriel must acquire, if he is to be with his beloved again. She will try to seduce him, to glamour him, but he will see through her mask, I am sure of it. He is so very strong now and even she must fear her own death at his hands. I smell her fear, her stench. Vampires can sense the living, but the dead she cannot. She knows Gabriel is here, yet she cannot sense death close at hand also. She knows what it is he wants. Poor, beautiful Carmilla, you will cry bloody tears before this night has ended!
    – Lords of Shadow Chapter 8-4
    ===
    The actual video:
    ===

    ===
    Whatever Zobek said about Carmilla glamouring Gabriel’s heart was completely ineffective when the two actually meet. In LoS2, the effect is less ambiguous.
    ===

    ===
    Here Dracul falls to a spell that can turn him into Camilla’s servant through blood possession, but he resists (well, with some help from Marie) until Carmilla is killed. The resistance to mind control is a bit iffy considering that it’s blood possession, and Dracul resists it by drinking more blood from both Marie and his enemies. That’s all I can remember about LoS Dracul resisting things similar to mind control.

    As for illusions, Dracul’s M.O. is to hit them til only the original remains, so that could get him into trouble.

    Guns are things that Dracul is familiar with, having dealt with a few in LoS2. His weapons and gauntlets can block machine gun fire, and his body can stay intact after being blasted close range with a shotgun. His answer to some of these gunmen after first encountering them is to disappear from sight through sheer speed and yank one of their hearts out.

  41. Spectral Observer July 27, 2015 at 1:46 am -      #41

    youtu.be/dClY6YCO9Q8&t=43s
    ===
    Edit timer ran out.

  42. AbsoluteZero July 27, 2015 at 2:10 am -      #42

    Let’s see… Rayne.

    She’d above human in regards to strength, and speed, stated to be so. But i’ll just give a layout on any abilities she possesses that might be worth a damn.

    Aura Vision: Rayne can see auras through solid objects, like walls. Naturally, she can see in the dark while doing this as well. However, it only illuminates things that are alive. The healthier the person, the easier they are to see. Considering the arguable death-state of many of the characters here, this may not be too useful.

    Ghost Feed: The stronger version of this ability is Enthrall, but that’s a mind control ability, so, as per above conditions, it’s got no place in this fight. Ghost Feed allows Rayne to have a spiritual version of herself drain a target, while she’s doing something else. She reaps the benefits of the feeding, healing faster.

    Super Speed/Dialated Perception: Rayne keeps moving while in this state at the same speed, however to her, everything else is simply moving at a snail’s pace. I’m still looking for a source to cite on this, because Youtube is being a pain. However in gameplay, she’s capable is easily weaving between bullets. (Not that useful, being that it’s gameplay, I grant.)

    Shapeshifting: Rayne gains the ability to turn into a Raven in Bloodrayne: Betrayal. Not much to be said about this. She’s a raven. Moving on.

    Poison Bite: Rayne can poison people with a bite, eventually causing their bodies to detonate. That said, I don’t see any of the mages being that easy to get close to. Rayne might be able to do so with her speed, but I still need to find her using it.

    Rayne also carries two pistols, called the Carpathian Dragons. Not all that much to say about them, aside from their ability to fire explosive rounds.

    She also carries a Harpoon at all times.

  43. Kitten Lord July 27, 2015 at 4:59 am -      #43

    @Mea

    ” it has an ultimate tensile strength of 234 to 372 MPa”

    If I recall the last time we calculated Raz’s strtiking force we used something weaker than that. What is the hardness number for that sort of iron? is it softer than granite, black granite etc?

    “Possession of new bodies would require Raziel to become familiar with these”

    Where did you get this from? Raziel transforms each body he possesses into his own body by force of will.

    ” Kain isn’t that durable, as he wears iron armor forged in hellfire”

    Mea, your pushing this crusade too far and your ignorance astonishes me. At least watch a few walkthroughs of the series. Learn timeliens and such. I have already told you Kain has not worn armour since BO 2, before becoming an Elder.

    Surprise surprise, guess what? he no longer wears armour, because someone who can tank hundreds of terapascals without a scratch would not need it.

    “Raziel’s claws should be enough to penetrate wought iron.”

    You realize Kain was punching through iron/steel armour and human bodies to grab their heart as early as BO 2, maybe earlier. This is before centuries/millenia of evolution.

    Iron, stone w/e, Raziel effortlessly makes short work of them. In the area of his hands no less. Hence why the extreme pressure. This pressure increases when you consider his blows do not turn the debris he makes when striking the blocks into projectiles, shooting about the room. Which is why I ask, how much more pressure/force is required to moltenise OR pulverise such materials?

    @Soul

    “-He doesn’t happen to have feats of resisting manipulation while in spirit form, does he? Because Arthas and Frostmourne are going to be a pretty rude awakening if he doesn’t.”

    Irrelevant really because time in spectral realm is twisted. Basically while he is in the spectral realm it is as if time has stopped. He would have to be in there for years, decades, or centuries for time to flow.

    So while in there, as far as he is concerned the fight above has frozen. Also to add to that, not usre Raziel is even a spirit while in the spectral realm, he is something else entirely and both vampiric and Raziels spirits appear to be immune to the Elder Gods manipulations.

    Also isnt the Lich King essentially a body? It could be beneficial for Raz to “use” the Lich King. I could have sworn someone said the first soul frostmourne devoured was Arthas’ own? One of the dreadlords?

    @Friendly

    “Who on the various other teams can see through illusions and invisibility?”


    When Raziel purifies his sight Kain can see the Elder God who is invisible and intangible to the physical plane.

    Vampires should be able to take this all the same. Dracula, Kain on the same team? ouch…

  44. Blaze July 27, 2015 at 10:33 am -      #44

    “Before and during the Skyrim Conquests around 1E 240, great Nordic war chiefs were also Tongues (Derek the Tall, Jorg Helmbolg, Hoag Merkiller).[2] They needed no typical siege weapons when attacking a city, instead using the Voice to break down the city gate and allow their armies to storm in.[7]”

    And yeah this men was just ordinary nords,nor grexbeard or dragonborn.So they only had the portion of the strenght of the thu’um of a nord

    -http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Thu’um

    If we do not enable the ultimately strong shouts and arthas’s insta kills,i will go with team techno,becoz Arnold and JC in the same team?It’s won alredy then.But if everybody can use most of their powers (expect mind controll) i would o with the magical being.

  45. Blaze July 27, 2015 at 10:34 am -      #45

    And yeah guys sorry for my bad grammar,i do not speak english very good.

  46. Mea quidem sententia July 27, 2015 at 10:45 am -      #46

    @Kitten Lord
    The hardness number for wrought iron is 105. The thing is, I’m not going to use Brinell’s hardness test to determine Raziel’s striking strength because Brinell’s hardness test relies on either a steel ball or a tungsten carbide ball. Each has a set load. I wouldn’t use this test to determine how much force came from a 9mm bullet, so I’m not going to use it here.

    I didn’t realize Raziel could will a possessed body as his own. That’s an interesting feat. Do you have a video of this happening?

    I’m not on a crusade. You’ve been on one for several years, Burning thought, Total Broadband. I’m working with the evidence you provided. You gave false information about Raziel acquiring greater durability upon defeating an elder vampire, which you then identified him as Marcus, a traitor vampire.

    Your conclusion is a non sequitur. It relies on the idea that Kain is more durable because he no longer wears armor. Maybe he stopped wearing armor because the developers decided to give him a different look. Maybe Kain no longer wears armor because he’s defeated the traitorous vampires and feels confident in his power to defeat anyone else who stands in his way. Whatever the reason, you haven’t proved your conclusion true. You’re trying to use what you hate: power scaling.

    I’m aware that Raziel could easily cut through humans with his claws, but cannot do the same with vampires, but the reason isn’t because these vampires have a harder dermis. It’s simply because they won’t remain impaled. You haven’t proved Kain’s durability reaches TPa. No one is on a crusade but you and no one is going to accept your nonsense except you.

    All right. So Kain and Raziel are similar in some respects. I’m not contesting that.

    To make iron melt, it has to reach a temperature of 1482°C on a low-end. Of course, a bullet hitting wrought iron won’t do anything that you’re asking for. Pressure doesn’t necessarily mean heat. You’ve asked this question before and I answered it at BankGamblingTopia. It’s called adiabatic pressure.

  47. Amm0vamp1r3 July 27, 2015 at 10:56 am -      #47

    I didn’t realize Raziel could will a possessed body as his own. That’s an interesting feat. Do you have a video of this happening?

    2:30

  48. pimpmage July 27, 2015 at 11:24 am -      #48

    Just some more bits before this turns into the millionth thread discussing Cain and raziel feats.

    Ahriman is the master of creating perfect illusions to fool people’s minds. I can get quotes later if asked. But he can change his appearance in others minds. Make himself look like an ally. And make that person believe that he is in a completely different place and time. Disguising his Allys as enemies. Or he could just melt people’s minds from a distance. Yank out all their memories and thoughts. Turn them into vegetables.

  49. Friendlysociopath July 27, 2015 at 12:31 pm -      #49

    What’s Twilight Ganondorf capable of? He’s the only member of Team Mage I don’t quite have a feel for.

    Dyr is definitely going to be a problem, anyone who can’t speed-blitz him is going to die, be incapacitated, or otherwise removed from the battlefield in short order.

    Abridged version of what Dyr can do:
    polymorph you (face the dreaded dire rabbit)
    standard blasting (fireball, lightning bolt)
    kill you (several of these)
    BFR you (several of these)
    paralyze you
    and use Wish to reality-warp you

    Video of Dracula in action:
    youtu.be/vUcUz5Vo6iw?t=1m15s

    Considering Deadpool is here, any team that can’t get through his regen is going to have and endless amount of equal parts chatter and bullets coming at them.

  50. Amm0vamp1r3 July 27, 2015 at 2:06 pm -      #50

  51. Mea quidem sententia July 27, 2015 at 2:22 pm -      #51

    Ganondorf from TP is Ganondorf fromOoT. He would be composite in this regard, but unlike Link from OoT to MM, he didn’t lose any of his abilities. I don’t think Ganondorf has anything going for him except his immunity to most attacks.

  52. Friendlysociopath July 27, 2015 at 3:57 pm -      #52

    From the looks of it, Team Mage has some uber-hax going for them.
    Ganondorf- damn near impossible to kill
    Ahriman- mental fuckery and then more mental fuckery
    Dyr- Dungeon and Dragons hax is some good hax
    Voldemort- Well… okay he’s not the best bet against almost anyone here.

    @Pimp
    Would you please post the quotes for Ahriman later? That sounds awesome

  53. Rookie July 27, 2015 at 4:50 pm -      #53

    @Friendlysociopath

    “Abridged version of what Dyr can do:
    polymorph you (face the dreaded dire rabbit)
    standard blasting (fireball, lightning bolt)
    kill you (several of these)
    BFR you (several of these)
    paralyze you
    and use Wish to reality-warp you”

    You forgot about his most nasty ability: factpile.com/10163-gromph-baenre-lichdrow-dyrr-vs-harry-dresden-ganondorf/ . Blackstone gigant transformation.

  54. pimpmage July 27, 2015 at 5:06 pm -      #54

    The scene I am talking about covers like 30 pages worth of text. I can summarise it tho. And give a smaller quote.

    So Inquisitor Czevak (Main character) was captured by his fellow inquisition members for the information he has about the black library. Czevak was jailed for a few days with these Inquisitional members. The main character did not give in to all manners of torture, he is in horrible condition in this scene.

    “Czevak’s vision faded for a moment, which didn’t unduly worry the inquisitor. Under the barrage of Confessor Graefe’s(Member of the Ecclesiarchy attached to the inquisition) mighty fists he was often knocked unconscious. This felt different, however. It was almost like having his head held under water and then being allowed to resurface. Blinking the light back to his eyes, Czevak found that impossibly his surroundings were changing. Both the walls of his prison and the faces of his gaolers were melting. His stomach had long been empty but if there had been anything in it then Czevak was sure that he would have brought it up on the deck. His center of gravity seemed to flip and his surroundings assumed a fresh terror.
    He was no longer in the dank catechorium of an Ordo Hereticus Black Ship. The unsmiling Inquisitorial serfs were gone, and in their place were droves of misshapen cultists, dressed in gaudy robes and afflicted with warped limbs and horrific mutations.”…”The Hexenguard(anti-psyker soldiers) were no longer hulking figures in blessed plate but Traitor Space Marines in ancient power armor, helmeted Thousand Sons in blistering azure clutching bolters and waiting obediently for orders. The only armored figures without helmets were the cloaked sorcerers who acted like lieutenants on the bridge, their unhealthy figures glowing with dark power and minds in constant congress with the warp. Chief among these was an androgynous tyrant standing where Sister Archangela Voightdecker (High ranking sister of battle) had been. With the traitor space marines and sorcerers standing about him, Czevak could only reason that he had never been an Ordo Hereticus prisoner aboard the Divine Thunder at all. His present predicament was far worse than that. His prison was in fact a chaos marine battle barge belonging to the Thousand sons traitor legion, masked through the duration of his confinement using Tzeentchian illusory magic.”

  55. Friendlysociopath July 27, 2015 at 5:45 pm -      #55

    Blackstone gigant transformation.


    Yep, I admit it- I forgot about that. So not only is he almost borderline magic-proof in his normal form; when he turns into a Blackstone Gigant he WILL be borderline magic-immune.

    It took a straight-up intervention from a D&D Goddess, Lolth, to stop him- not wish, not powerful weapons or some manner of trick; Lolth herself had to interfere to stop him.
    So far as D&D goes, that’s pretty damn impressive.

    @Pimp
    Huh, well that seems pretty good for what someone who fucks with minds can do.

  56. Kitten Lord July 27, 2015 at 6:26 pm -      #56

    @Mea

    ” You gave false information about Raziel acquiring greater durability upon defeating an elder vampire, which you then identified him as Marcus, a traitor vampire.”

    I never said anything of the sort, and I will ask you to quote where I said any of these things to prove otherwise.

    “It relies on the idea that Kain is more durable because he no longer wears armor”

    No,I was just countering your logic when you said he uses the protection of iron armour. I called you out on it and corrected you, he does not.

    My conclusion relies on him tanking the great forces Raziel outputs, or rather great pressures coming from superhuman forces.

    ” You haven’t proved Kain’s durability reaches TPa”

    Check the respect thread. It is all there.

    “No one is on a crusade but you ”

    Right, which is why you only enter this thread to discuss this one subject apparently.

    “To make iron melt, it has to reach a temperature of 1482°C on a low-end. Of course, a bullet hitting wrought iron won’t do anything that you’re asking for. Pressure doesn’t necessarily mean heat. You’ve asked this question before and I answered it at BankGamblingTopia. It’s called adiabatic pressure”

    So how much pressure do you need to hit iron with to make it a powder? From solid to powder in one strike.

  57. Soulerous July 27, 2015 at 7:32 pm -      #57

    Call me crazy, but I really don’t think iron can turn to powder with an impact of any pressure. It will just warp or break.

  58. Kitten Lord July 27, 2015 at 7:44 pm -      #58

    I think there is a point of pressure where something more than that is going to happen. If we take something extreme like focus the net pressure of the big bang on a lump of iron, its not just going to snap in half is it…

  59. Friendlysociopath July 27, 2015 at 9:01 pm -      #59

    From solid to powder in one strike.

    I don’t think physics works like that.
    Metal breaks, or bends; it doesn’t turn to powder no matter how hard you hit it.

    So what can Gandalf do? Most of what I remember is he’s implied to be a BAMF with extreme power but we don’t really get to see it.

  60. Mea quidem sententia July 27, 2015 at 9:02 pm -      #60

    I have no exact quote from you, other than that you said Kain had become more durable after defeating an elder vampire. When I asked who this vampire was, you didn’t say. I had to ask more that twice before until you finally mentioned Marcus in the DBZ vs. Kain thread.

    Your reason for Kain’s enhanced durability relies on a non sequitur. Maybe Kain became moredurable, but saying he doesn’t wear armor because of this is not a valid reason. Or at least not one you proved. To correct me, you need to support yor argument with evidence. Your thread does no justice for Kain.

    Everyone should expect this continuous argument to happen with you. Fortunately, others now see through your rhetoric. As for iron, because it is ductile and malleable, it’d sooner deform (plasticity) that to become dust. Harder materials seem stiffer, not elastic, meaning iron would fracture with enough force.

  61. AbsoluteZero July 27, 2015 at 9:06 pm -      #61

    “So what can Gandalf do? Most of what I remember is he’s implied to be a BAMF with extreme power but we don’t really get to see it.”

    He’s… I actually think he might be less useful than Voldemort. He’s got a lot of implications of power, but he never uses it that much. Wizards in LOTR are old men as well, in order to stop them from gaining an excessive amount of power. It’s a restraining mechanism. And not one that’s easily thrown off. It could be worth noting that Gandalf was originally chosen to be the White Wizard, ages before LOTR, but refused the role on the grounds that Saruman knew Sauron better (Gandalf proving he’s a fantastic judge of character. Ha.)

    But, hey. Gandalf -can- shine a light at people.

  62. Soulerous July 27, 2015 at 9:08 pm -      #62

    If we take something extreme like focus the net pressure of the big bang on a lump of iron, its not just going to snap in half is it…
    -Right. It’s going to atomize and become plasma.

  63. Amm0vamp1r3 July 27, 2015 at 9:32 pm -      #63

    Some things that ive found from one of the LoK dev, Daniel Cabuco (an arist on the legacy of kain games so take that into consideration before you take it at face value)

    The Reaver
    How much more powerful do you want the Reaver be? Lol! You kill someone with it and their skeleton flies out of their skin, and their soul gets devoured.
    It stopped being a blood devouring weapon once Raziel entered it.
    However, I imagine it would still retain Raziel’s ability to become imbued with certain elements or aspects temporarily.
    The Emblems were a means for Kain to imbue the Reaver and (I feel) are redundant and unnecessary now that Raziel’s soul resides within.

    The Soul Reaver is the Blood Reaver transformed. It no longer acts as a blood drinking weapon but instead drains their souls.
    Kain’s emblems were for the Scion of Balance, not really for the Reaver per se.
    While the Soul Reaver could be temporarily embued, I don’t think it would retain any of the old abilities from the emblems.


    Kains Skin

    Welcome and thank you for the great question. Kain’s skin is hardened to an armor (more flexible in some areas than others) which serves to protect him from sunlight and weapon damage. This replaced his need to have traditional forms of armor, and shows off his power. (and Hubris to some extent) The color is somewhat golden/skin colored, but not high metallic. His skin is not made up of scales. Chitinous refers to the exoskeletal nature of his skin.The scaly part was in reference to the actual texture of his skin not what it’s made up of. (ie if you ran your hands over it, it would be tough but smooth, with little aberrations on it)
    Really I haven’t thought that deeply on how Kain would evolve, because we didn’t get into preproduction for it (where I or some other artist would spend a lot of time going over this look design) Perhaps like his Scion image… I wanted to have Kain looking more human in indoor lighting and when he steps into the sunlight, have his armored evolved form appear. (A good dev could do that with the Durango and Orbis when they come out) When I mentioned retaining the best parts of Kain, it was more figurative.. that he’d still be an anti-hero who follows his own rules about right and wrong. Not perfect, or altruistic, but rather driven to see his version of reality come to light (and being able to make hard choices to get it done). That’s what I love about Kain as a character, and what I tried to embody with his physical design. He even influenced his own evolution through sheer force of will.



    So make of that what you will

  64. Friendlysociopath July 27, 2015 at 9:38 pm -      #64

    But, hey. Gandalf -can- shine a light at people.

    He’s got some other stuff:

    Snazzy teleportation + splosion

    Pretty sure his sword gives him extra force or something too- judging by how Thorin reacts when he uses his

    He seems to either have TK or the ability to hit further than his staff can reach


    Plus just the general power to push back evil


    And can apparently break through spells that hide you


    If nothing else, the enemy shall not pass


    So make of that what you will

    I make it out to be as hard as his armor

  65. Amm0vamp1r3 July 27, 2015 at 9:47 pm -      #65

    Actually there was a few more

    Kain (cont)
    Kain had lightning and a teleportation ability, which for gameplay purposes in Defiance, we turned into the mist form. Kain had a whole host of spells from Blood Omen that I wanted to kind of re-do for the next game (flay for example). It’s thought that he didn’t really need many of the spells though, since he was so tough (and had the Soul Reaver) For Dark Prophecy, I wanted him to come back with his beast and wolf forms, as well as mind control, and the ability to look human. (His skin would reveal it’s elder look in direct sunlight)
    The lieutenants would have their appropriate properties, but just futher developed and refined (not as brutish as they ended up in the SR time)
    Standard abilities included TK blood drain, Bite, heal over time, immortality, glide/feather fall, limited telekenesis, and I think mist form. (though I am not entirely sure about the last one)


    Now that’s th

  66. pimpmage July 27, 2015 at 9:49 pm -      #66

    There is another scene in my book that shows Ahriman fending off a hitsquad of eldar harlequins. The same ones that effortlessly massacred a deathwatch squad of space marines earlier in the book. But there is one problem.

    In 40k books, when there is an important villian in the plot, one that is basically a ‘hero’ character of the evil guys(Ahriman). They cannot die. The plot throws challenging encounters at the guy, but you just know that there won’t be any actual danger. Kinda ruins these scenes imo. So the plot basically dumbs down these eldar when they fight ahriman.

    “Now that’s th”

    Go on…. lol

  67. Amm0vamp1r3 July 27, 2015 at 9:50 pm -      #67

    the last bit, but like I said dudes only an artist on the team so his (Views, Opinions, Statements or what have you) should probably be taken with a grain or two of salt

  68. Mea quidem sententia July 27, 2015 at 10:43 pm -      #68

    So Kain has chitinous skin? His skin may very well be like that of an insect, as my wife and I have discussed several months ago. Just because Kain has teeth, doesn’t mean he has bone, unless we have any evidence of this. Teeth are made of dentin. I suppose in Skyrim, Kain’s skin would be equivalent to chitin armor.

  69. Soulerous July 27, 2015 at 10:54 pm -      #69

    Kain was human before becoming a vampire, yes? So we’d have to assume he has bones.

  70. Friendlysociopath July 27, 2015 at 10:57 pm -      #70

    Just because Kain has teeth, doesn’t mean he has bone, unless we have any evidence of this.

    Raziel after his dunking is pretty much only bone- plus the scraps of his wings that survived for… reasons despite most of his flesh being peeled away; boy, that’s convenient.

  71. Darth Bombad July 27, 2015 at 11:21 pm -      #71

    Not that i’m supporting the “Kain has no bones” theory but in LoK vampires
    that evolve into elders tend to be wildly different from eachother.

    Llike shark guy.
    fc06.deviantart.net/fs8/i/2005/326/4/0/Fishy__Rahab__by_Fera_Feueragian.jpg
    Or this… thing.
    fc00.deviantart.net/fs45/i/2009/070/4/b/Zephon_by_Splurch2006.jpg

    But Kain’s still mostly human so i doubt his change would be that extreme.

  72. Spectral Observer July 27, 2015 at 11:35 pm -      #72

    See what I find interesting with the quotes on Kain’s abilities was that the dev needed to mention a heal over time ability, as if to imply that Kain does take damage from his enemies after all, and is not this ludicrously durable juggernaut that he’s been painted as in the past few debates.

    Also that the Reaver needs to kill someone before it takes their soul, much like the stance I argued for in Dracul vs. Kain. It may be time to revisit that thread soon.

  73. Mea quidem sententia July 28, 2015 at 12:31 am -      #73

    Not necessarily, Soulerous. Kain has three fingers on each hand as opposed to five, and his skin isn’t exactly human. I suposed I would be beter odf assuming Kain has an endoskeleton.

    I agree, Spectral Observer. I also agree with going back and reevaluating the threads involving Raziel and Kain. I’m sure the two are pretty powerful, even without the whole durability argument.

  74. Friendlysociopath July 28, 2015 at 1:13 am -      #74

    I’m sure the two are pretty powerful, even without the whole durability argument.

    I’d just like to point out in the original version that they were planning on had Kain being actually wounded and then killed by Raziel, Raziel would then go on to commit Vampire Genocide via a holy hymn blasted across the earth.
    Which is probably the main reason I’m against that durability argument, Kain is not meant to be immune to damage like Kitten says. He regens, he heals, because he can be hurt by his enemies.

    Most of Raziel’s power-ups are platformer power-ups; they just allow you to solve puzzles. He was intended to get spells but they were cut due to time constraints.
    Raziel is pretty much physical force and TK; plus his ability to remake his body.

  75. Shadow-Knight July 28, 2015 at 1:30 am -      #75

    So, I would just like to point out that Team Techno (most of it anyway) is going to be immune to things like mind-fuckery , soul-fuckery, vamperic blood sucking, and probably good magic resistance in general. The T-3000 in particular is a heavy hitter who is immune to virtually all physical attacks, can shape shift, phase through people and has superior strength when compared to all other terminator models.

  76. Spectral Observer July 28, 2015 at 2:09 am -      #76

    Dracul shouldn’t have any issues against Voldemort, as I said before. Ganondorf might take a while longer if only for that pesky resistance of his. If none of Dracul’s soul-damaging/life stealing weapons work, he could always use the Vampire Killer, which not only doubles as a holy artifact (God’s most powerful symbol on earth according to WoG), but can also kill immortals like Satan (also WoG). That is probably Dracul’s key to killing some of the immortals here like Deadpool if nothing else works. The machines might be a problem however. To my knowledge, I don’t know if Dracul has anything that can damage vibranium, so Ultron and Vision are going to be a problem if he comes across them.

    @Friendly

    How fast is Dyrr? One of the videos I posted showed Dracul completely vanishing from sight and grabbing onto his target’s heart before tossing them aside. He was also able to block magic lightning with his sword:
    ===
    youtu.be/E8bMygozqW0&t=8m45s
    ===
    8m45s

    As for Ahriman, I’ve got nothing. Dracul may or may not be able to resist mind control on account of resisting blood possession, but he has no answer to perfect illusions. The last one who used illusions against him was Carmilla, and he only saw through that because she was being an obvious idiot, and by hitting her illusions until only the original remained. The tk may not work on his weapons since they are physical manifestations of his feelings of emptiness (Void) and rage (Chaos) or his solidified blood (Shadow whip/daggers). Besides that, he’s pretty flame resistant. The gorgons’ fire breath can instantly heat up stone on contact to the point where it’s glowing, and Dracul takes this to the face without flinching. He then reflects it back to sender and partially manifests his Dragon Form.
    ===
    youtu.be/RqCZiRrjiY4&t=3m15s
    ===
    3m15s

    Since those flames were also Chaos Flames due to drawing power from the Primordial Chaos Gem, it gets an added flavor of burning souls, which Dracul also tanks.

  77. Friendlysociopath July 28, 2015 at 2:23 am -      #77

    How fast is Dyrr?

    You mean movement sped or casting speed? Casting speed is in 6 seconds at best.
    Actually he has Haste, so call it one second per spell; two for the worst bet. Also, everyone on Team Mage moves at 2x speed for everything.

    Team Mage might be able to just sit behind an illusion and let everyone tire themselves out on each other and the monsters before coming out to fight- it’d even be moderately in-character for some of them.

  78. Spectral Observer July 28, 2015 at 2:45 am -      #78

    @Friendly

    Both.

    Can he move while casting, or does he have to stay stationary? Keeping still isn’t exactly a good thing to do against someone who mist-forms/teleports more than walking in combat, and who can rip apart armored knights barehanded into a bloody paste. That’s not even factoring in the bonus perks of team vampire’s weapons, or the time magic both Kain and Dracul possess. For Dracul, he can slow down any enemy he tags which kinda sucks to be honest, but 2x movement speed for the likes of Ganon and Voldemort is still going to be child’s play.

  79. AbsoluteZero July 28, 2015 at 3:04 am -      #79

    Well, Gandalf doesn’t really seem to be packing that many more feats than Voldemort. Both can teleport, and have AoE moves. However, Gandalf shares Voldemorts weakness in having a lack of feats, and generally being limited to human reaction time. Something that’ll inevitably get them both butchered.

    I’ll also point out that Voldemort is an accomplished illusionist. He created various traps and illusions around his Horcruxes in Harry Potter to avoid them being easily found. Most notably the lake of inferi. Which was hidden inside a cave on a cliff face, with no door. In fact, Dumbledore only found it because he had taught Voldemort in the first place, and knew how his magic worked.

    Putting Voldemort in a defensive position definitely gives him some more utility. If you give him the feats for all the various traps he sets up throughout the series, that is.

    Also, it has to be asked. How many of Voldemorts enemies could survive Fiendfyre? Which can consume huge areas, and was shown capable of obliterating a Horcrux.

    Also worth noting, Crucio. Voldemort does possess the ability to inflict the utter pinnacle of pain on anyone he pleases. Even if that doesn’t kill, it’d easily take someone out of the fight, and potentially stop them moving long enough for him to kill them. Also, speedblitzing Voldemort could rapidly become a total pain in the ass if he decides to start teleporting constantly (Which he can do) or flying. Potentially both.

  80. Friendlysociopath July 28, 2015 at 3:29 am -      #80

    Both.

    Casting time is only a few seconds, less if Hasted. His movement speed likely isn’t that great unless he’s flying or something.

    Can he move while casting, or does he have to stay stationary?

    He can cast while moving, flying, invisible- pretty much anything.

    Keeping still isn’t exactly a good thing to do against someone who mist-forms/teleports more than walking in combat, and who can rip apart armored knights barehanded into a bloody paste.

    Keeping still while invisible and/or behind an illusion isn’t that bad. And it’s standard MO for Wizards in D&D. Dyr is literally going to either oneshot people or incapacitate them if they don’t blitz him; and they can’t blitz him if they don’t know he’s there.

    Hell, he has both Limited Wish and actual Wish, that opens up just WTF levels of him being able to do whatever he wants without reprisal; subject to discussion mind you. Contrary to what someone told me, he cannot simply Wish someone to turn into antimatter.

  81. pimpmage July 28, 2015 at 3:45 am -      #81

    “Hell, he has both Limited Wish and actual Wish, that opens up just WTF levels of him being able to do whatever he wants without reprisal; subject to discussion mind you. Contrary to what someone told me, he cannot simply Wish someone to turn into antimatter.”

    Depending on what system he hails from, there are game mechanic restrictions to those spells. But game mechanics can also be described as universal physics. Physics can only bend so far with that spell. Some editions have gold value limits on changes. So wishes do not give infinite wealth or power. And if you were to wish for super strength or intelligence, you don’t become the strongest or smartest individual in the universe.

  82. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 5:18 am -      #82

    @mea

    ” other than that you said Kain had become more durable after defeating an elder vampire”

    So can you quote this? because I would never say that.


    “ou finally mentioned Marcus in the DBZ vs. Kain thread.”

    I mentioned him, but not regarding what your talking about.

    “Maybe Kain became moredurable, but saying he doesn’t wear armor because of this is not a valid reason”

    When did I say he is more durable because he does not wear armour? I think its clear I think hes more durable because resisted Raziels superhuman slashes but more to the point, I was, as I said countering the fact you brought up this “non sequiter” youself when you argued Kain wearing iron armour;

    “Kain isn’t that durable, as he wears iron armor forged in hellfire.”

    Post34, this thread (see, I quoted you to prove what you said, and what I had umbrage against).

    You made this non sequitor yourself and I showed you how erronous the comment was by pointing out that Kain actually does not anymore. So using your own fallacious comment there against you, your own logic would argue Kain is “more durable” because he does not wear iron armour.

    My own view is it does not matter really what he wears, although the fact he no longer wears armour should be considered. Obviously at some point he realized he no longer needed it because he was wearing it before. I cannot think of why he would not use it still if he needed it.

    “Fortunately, others now see through ”

    They do not, they just argue because they think the longer they stall the facts and ignore them the longer the issue becomes unresolved. Truth is its already resolved as can be seen in the respect thread, them ignoring it does not change anything.

    “So Kain has chitinous skin?”

    Maybe, as Ammo said Daniel although a dev was just the artist. Pretty much all his comments start with the same my comments do when I do not know something 100%, i.e “I think” or “maybe”, “I belive”

    He is not Amy Hennig….

    “ust because Kain has teeth, doesn’t mean he has bone”

    He evolved from a human essentially so yes he has bone. But even others have covered this.

    “I agree, Spectral Observer. I also agree with going back and reevaluating the threads involving Raziel and Kain”

    If anything Kain has just gotten more powerful over time as more complicated calculations come up but I do not think Kain won any matches based purely on durability.

    @Soul

    “-Right. It’s going to atomize and become plasma.”

    Exactly, which proves that there are “states” it becomes smaller, rather than just bending or breaking. At some point its going to break into smaller and smaller parts, with the final extreme end being atomic.

    @Spectral

    “See what I find interesting with the quotes on Kain’s abilities was that the dev needed to mention a heal over time ability”

    Well he does heal. Vampires have a regen factor.

    “Also that the Reaver needs to kill someone before it takes their soul”

    Not the case, as Kain says and displays on Raziel it devours souls on strike.

    @Friendly

    “Which is probably the main reason I’m against that durability argument, Kain is not meant to be immune to damage like Kitten says. He regens, he heals, because he can be hurt by his enemies.”

    If anything this solidifies my argument. the devs were going to have Kain get killed, then they retconned it to only wounded as of Soul reaver 1, where Kain is holding his chest in Pain, then they retconned it a third time to make Kain completely unharmed.

    If anything the Devs agree with me equivalently so.

    @Thread

    Team Techno with their immunity to hax may be the only problem for the vamps. I say Kain could just incapciate all of them, freezing them in time. Then they get buried or thrown into space or w/e

    Or just leave them frozen while the Mages die and then grab the medal.

  83. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 6:43 am -      #83

    Ok new strength feat for Raziel;

    I used this calculator;

    www.calculatoredge.com/matweight/material%20wt.htm

    The blocks are a few feet or so taller than Raziel. Raz is about 6ft as an eastimate so I rounded off for ease at about 10 ft side length/width.

    This means each block weighs around 280 tons. If it were solid. Moving four of them would mean he is shifting 1100 tons or thereabouts.

    I then calculated the hexagons. Which would have a side wdith of around 3ft (their not quite half as long as the cubes sides) and length around 5ft tops.

    This allowed me to cut out the hexagons, which each weigh around 11 tons.

    The final number without rounding would give me around 1077 tons of weight which Raziel pulled around the room no harder than he does the stone blocks.

    This adds up with the 1k ton Obelisk. Which he flips. He then goes on to “slap” each of those 269 or so ton blocks off so they are separate…

    But that is not all ladies and gentlemen. If you watch at 5:05, he has to push 3 of them stacked at once…

    www.easycalculation.com/physics/classical-physics/force.php

    So Raziels effortless slaps using this calcluator allows him to move a 807 ton stack. He slaps it 10 feet in about 800 milliseconds or less. So roughly 4 m/s

    He applies’ 2928392 newtons, or 2.9 million with an effortless slap.

    Crikey mates….what do ya know…very similar to him piercing blocks at 1.2 million in Meas original calcs, or 6.2 million, according to the mathematicians at Physics Forum.

    Things are starting to add up even more than they did before.

    This means he should be able to output;

    371.9 Mega-newtons with some strenuous activity.

  84. Soulerous July 28, 2015 at 7:31 am -      #84

    Exactly, which proves that there are “states” it becomes smaller, rather than just bending or breaking. At some point its going to break into smaller and smaller parts, with the final extreme end being atomic.
    -Powder is not one of those states. For a piece of iron to be crushed into powder, it would simply need to be significantly more brittle than iron actually is.
    ~
    This means each block weighs around 280 tons.
    -What on Earth are they made of?

  85. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 8:05 am -      #85

    @Soul

    “-Powder is not one of those states.”

    Can you find some science proving this? Something online that says it is absolutely impossible to powder iron?

    “What on Earth are they made of?”

    Copper.

  86. Soulerous July 28, 2015 at 8:32 am -      #86

    Where’s the proof that those blocks are made of copper?
    ~
    Something online that says it is absolutely impossible to powder iron?
    -It isn’t impossible to powder iron. It’s impossible to do so with one impact. I see no reason to search out definitive proof of this because I’m replying to the question of how much pressure solid iron must be hit with to turn to powder in one strike. That’s not a debating point because you weren’t claiming a feat, you were just asking. If you were to claim a feat you would have to produce some hard data to answer your own question.

  87. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 8:39 am -      #87

    @Soul

    “Where’s the proof that those blocks are made of copper?”

    Well first their, you know…copper. What other metal has the color of copper?


    Further, their pipes. Copper piping is used for directing air flows for sound instruments which is what Raziel is building, a massive one.

    Those two things combined sort of make Copper the only thing it could be.

    “It’s impossible to do so with one impact.”

    Well ok, how do we know?

    ” If you were to claim a feat ”

    Well yeah, but I am asking. Its the only way I could explain how Raziel claws into metal and stone blocks.

  88. Soulerous July 28, 2015 at 8:49 am -      #88

    Those two things combined sort of make Copper the only thing it could be.
    -No… they make it possible. It is not the only thing possible, nor is it at all conclusive.
    ~
    Wood and stone has been used for piping for a long time. Copper is not the only thing the color of those blocks. They look like they’re wood or stone.
    ~
    If they’re copper then just show where the game or a dev says they’re made of copper. Otherwise it doesn’t count for the feat.
    ~
    Its the only way I could explain how Raziel claws into metal and stone blocks.
    -What do you mean? You don’t have to turn something to powder to stab it.

  89. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 8:56 am -      #89

    @Soul

    “Wood and stone”

    Wood is distinctive in appearance and colour, almost as distinctive as copper which is what this looks like. As stone erodes, I have never heard of anyone using stone to create an organ,especially a large one.

    We know its copper because of its age as well, that has been there for centuries if not millennia. Stone erodes too quickly, wood rots. Copper? not quite as much.

    Can you show me a wooden or stone instrument, preferably a large one that consists of pipes? Woodwind is possible but on that scale? not likely, that age and still working without rot or issue? no, clawred into without breaking down? not likely again….

    Colour? nope, copper wood? wut…..

    Course, brass has been used for instruments and the colour is, albeit far shinier and more gold similar to copper.

    “Otherwise it doesn’t count for the feat.”

    What an interesting conclusion, so according to you every material in fiction has to be specifcally stated? so when Superman punches a building, assuming tis made of stone or steel is wrong, the writer had to write in the comic it was made of steel or w/e?

    Good to know the trickster of absurd ideas is still up to his game…

    ” You don’t have to turn something to powder to stab it.”

    When Raziels claws, which are relatively large take up the space the material that was there used to be. Where is this material going? It is either crushed into powder, liquefied or w/e OR it breaks through and shatters structure.

    Considering we know Raziel does not destroy his blocks then he must hit them hard enough to at the veyr least turn the material into putty.

  90. Neon Lord July 28, 2015 at 9:00 am -      #90

    “Exactly, which proves that there are “states” it becomes smaller, rather than just bending or breaking. At some point its going to break into smaller and smaller parts, with the final extreme end being atomic.”

    The application of force to an object is different from the application of energy via heat.

    Iron will either break or bend if struck by a singular impact, depending on the force and the material properties of the iron if it is alloyed. The only way you can turn powder into metal with physical force is sanding it, or actually cutting individual grains of metal out somehow.

  91. Soulerous July 28, 2015 at 9:10 am -      #91

    I don’t need to show you a single thing. Just prove that it’s copper. Calling me a trickster doesn’t help your case, either.
    ~
    When Raziels claws, which are relatively large take up the space the material that was there used to be. Where is this material going?
    -Onto the floor, probably. Unless it’s wood, in which case it can just compress. The blocks are visually unmarked afterward; the graphics just aren’t showing us all the details of the clawing.

  92. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 9:15 am -      #92

    @Soul

    “I don’t need to show you a single thing.”

    I did not think you could. I have shown a metal object, that is copper and used in piping, which is what copper is used for.

    Therefore, logic indicates it is copper regardless of your apparenty insistent implication that text and actual words have to be provided for everything as if visuals are completely irrelevant despite it being multimedia and not a textbook/audio creation.

    “he blocks are visually unmarked afterward; the graphics just aren’t showing us all the details of the clawing.”

    I am not interested in the graphics. I am interested in the facts, which is that Raziel claws blocks, he breaks into the block but unless he mulches what his claw is filling that excess stone is going to shatter the thing.

    Which means he would not be able to use it. Hence why I need to know the force/pressure required to instant melt, mulch, powder or disintegrate iron, steel, copper, stone etc.

  93. Soulerous July 28, 2015 at 9:19 am -      #93

    Therefore, logic indicates it is copper.
    -No, logic indicates it can be copper. That doesn’t mean it is. It can also be wood or stone. You are guessing that it’s copper. Your guess is no better than mine.

  94. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 9:23 am -      #94

    @Soul

    “It can also be wood or stone. ”

    And I pointed out why it could not be wood or stone. Why it would not be. There are no stones that consist of a single coppery smooth sheet. Your basically just randomly saying materials, I men we can all do that! maybe it could be made of neutron star material? hmmmm, lets ponder….”sigh”

    I will change my comment to it “could” be brass OR copper though. But I still would say, due to durability and colour that copper is more likely.

  95. Soulerous July 28, 2015 at 9:28 am -      #95

    And I pointed out why it could not be wood or stone.
    -No you did not. You pointed out why you doubt, but your reasons do not render wood or stone invalid possibilities. These are common crafting materials- more common than copper. They come in many colors. The blocks are not made of copper by virtue of you believing it to be the most logical or likely conclusion.

  96. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 9:34 am -      #96

    @Soul

    ” do not render wood”

    I have completely invalidated wood. Its hundreds of years old, and is used for a massive organ. Raziel is also piercing it, the sound does not sound of wood which. Take into account colour, sound and the qualities of wood and that leaves wood as impossible.

    “These are common crafting materials-”

    Stone is not a common crafting material for making air compressive pipes or instruments….wood is, brass is, but I crossed off wood already.

    Ill say assuming it did not look like copper in colour and it was dark like other stone blocks Raziel moves then you could be right but I have never heard of a stone organ. Also erosion, how can stone be the tube for a massive air organ? Then last for centuries…

    You brought this up, so show me. How this is a possibility that needs to be considered. otherwise your just mentioning crafting materials. Steel is another known metal for compressive pipes but its the wrong colour again…

  97. Soulerous July 28, 2015 at 9:47 am -      #97

    The color of stone is determined by it’s mineral composition. Because of this, rock can be almost any hue there is. This is why precious stones like diamonds or rubies vary in color. Wood comes in a wide variety of natural colors depending on the species. Here are some examples. I have even seen pink-hued wood personally.
    ~
    You mentioned an organ, so here are three instances of organs with wood pipes.
    ~
    Its hundreds of years old
    -And what?
    ~
    “Back in the 13th century, however, they built this arcade in wood. Here it is, eight hundred years later, and the exposed wood of the arcade is still there, still holding up masonry walls above it.”
    -(Source)
    ~
    “Wood can last for centuries.” -(Source)
    ~
    otherwise your just mentioning crafting materials.
    -And you’re just mentioning copper. You haven’t invalidated stone or wood. I think the blocks look like maple.

  98. Amm0vamp1r3 July 28, 2015 at 9:58 am -      #98

    Is the the silenced cathedral?

    If so I believed Raziel said
    “Once a testament to mankind’s defiance of Kain’s empire, this towering cathedral now stood derelict, the humans who worshipped here, centuries dead. Its architects conceived this tower as a holy weapon against the vampire menace, a colossal instrument of brass and stone. The cathedral’s pipes, once tuned to blast a deadly hymn, now stood silent, and these vacant spaces whistled their impotence.”

  99. Kitten Lord July 28, 2015 at 10:18 am -      #99

    Thanks Ammo. Brass then confirmed. Which has similar density to copper.

  100. Soulerous July 28, 2015 at 10:54 am -      #100

    Do you understand why you were wrong to treat it as fact that the blocks were copper? That’s what concerns me.

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